Les Davenport-changed is belief?

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EatDeer
 
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RE: Les Davenport-changed is belief?

Postby EatDeer » Mon Aug 18, 2008 8:51 am

ORIGINAL: hunter480

And so now we have the other side of the story.....

I`d only say thanks to Les for making the statement he did, about not ever demeaning another hunters kill.

And even though I`m sounding like a broken record here, I`ll say it yet again...the whole obsession with rack measurement, is just another issue we as hunters, have to somehow fix. It`s crazy that there could ever even be the suggestion, that anyone`s kill could be judged/demeaned by anyone else. And it never would happen, except in the context of, the rack is subpar, therefore, it`s an "inferior" deer.

Good God people, wake up! Stop attacking a legal, ethical kill, by a legal, licensed hunter. It isn`t "B&C, P&Y, qdm approved, deer hunting. It`s simply "deer" hunting. Even the moniker qdm, infers that some deer aren`t "quality" animals. That`s completely absurd.

Each and every deer killed, in an ethical and legal manner, by a legal and licensed hunter is a "quality" deer, regardless of the rack size, and unless you subscribe to this notion, YOU are an inpediment to deer hunting, and what it stands for.
QDM is not about culling poor quality bucks , that's trophy deer management. You must be mis-informed, qdm is used to achieve a healthier deer herd,from doe harvests,and passing young bucks into older age classes, land management,etc.
"Let a young buck go, so he can grow."

JeffB
 
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RE: Les Davenport-changed is belief?

Postby JeffB » Mon Aug 18, 2008 9:50 am

Make sure everyone knows that I am not attacking or talking bad about Les. I didnt expext Les to remember me either, he encouters hundreds of hunters every year. I just was stating what my "experience" with him was on that day in comparison with his aricle Antler Illness. I am not here to argue what was said except that there was witness' (even the land owner) that couldn't believe he acted that way either.
If anyone had ever had "Antler Illness" it is Les. If you had ever been to his place in Brown Co it was like a little Jackson Hole WY with all the antlers on his entry way and house.

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djohns13
 
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RE: Les Davenport-changed is belief?

Postby djohns13 » Fri Aug 22, 2008 12:48 pm

Well now, it seems we have a situation where we will have to agree to disagree on this one.  I am sure that Jeff B's memory of the situation is pretty crisp since he was affected so much.  And certainly Les feels that his actions don't attack other hunters.  Additionally, this happened years ago.  The key points here are two: first, believe and act however you want (as long as it is legal) but let others do the same without judgment and second, the common enemy is out there and it isn't any of us!!!!  There are very organized, highly motivated, well funded anti-hunting groups that are succeeding in shifting the U.S. culture away from all of our core beliefs.  If we want our children and grand-children to enjoy the outdoors like we do, we need to organize and unite against them. 
 
Don't get me wrong, I am not trying to lecture anyone.  Please, just remember that while we may have major differences in beliefs about all sort of deer hunting issues, in the end we agree much more than we disagree.  We are not the enemy and all of our time and energy should be spent fighting the real enemy.
 
Jeff and Les, I am not trying to chastise you in any way.  I bet you are both great guys that I would love hanging out and hunting with.  I am just using you to illustrate a point.
 
Good shooting.
Darren Johnson
Internet Pro Staff Member - Indiana


Glad to talk to all of you, but I'd rather be sitting in a tree stand on a cool morning trying not to move so that the bruiser buck directly below me doesn't figure out that I am watching him!

gutpile
 
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RE: Les Davenport-changed is belief?

Postby gutpile » Sun Sep 07, 2008 11:58 am

First off if a guy talked to me like that, he wouldn't do it twice..
And I will have to agree with 480 on this issue..People have turned deer hunting into a chest beating frenzy, all the is talk about P&Y and B&C, like you have to have a deer score in order for it to be a trophy, I would love to kill giant bucks and bulls, that's why I hunt hard, I have taken a fair share of good deer & elk, but i make the decision when I see the animal if I am gonna kill it, and if it doesn't measure up to what you consider a trophy oh well KMA...
Wheat is harvested, Animals are killed...

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EatDeer
 
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RE: Les Davenport-changed is belief?

Postby EatDeer » Sun Sep 07, 2008 11:19 pm

ORIGINAL: gutpile

First off if a guy talked to me like that, he wouldn't do it twice..
And I will have to agree with 480 on this issue..People have turned deer hunting into a chest beating frenzy, all the is talk about P&Y and B&C, like you have to have a deer score in order for it to be a trophy, I would love to kill giant bucks and bulls, that's why I hunt hard, I have taken a fair share of good deer & elk, but i make the decision when I see the animal if I am gonna kill it, and if it doesn't measure up to what you consider a trophy oh well KMA...
Every deer harvested, I consider a trophy to a degree, but I can't bring myself to harvest any buck that is smaller then the last one I took, its just to easy. When someone is practicing QDM, or even TDM for that matter they have to set some size or age standards for bucks harvested on the property, surely you can't fault a land owner/manager for that?  You would love to kill giant bucks, but harvest any small buck that walks by? Kinda sounds like your hunting methods are  counter productive.  If Bill Jorden invited you to one of his whitetail hunting ranches, and told you to harvest a mature 150" or larger buck, would you shoot a yearling buck? 
"Let a young buck go, so he can grow."

gutpile
 
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RE: Les Davenport-changed is belief?

Postby gutpile » Mon Sep 08, 2008 8:19 am

ORIGINAL: EatDeer

ORIGINAL: gutpile

First off if a guy talked to me like that, he wouldn't do it twice..
And I will have to agree with 480 on this issue..People have turned deer hunting into a chest beating frenzy, all the is talk about P&Y and B&C, like you have to have a deer score in order for it to be a trophy, I would love to kill giant bucks and bulls, that's why I hunt hard, I have taken a fair share of good deer & elk, but i make the decision when I see the animal if I am gonna kill it, and if it doesn't measure up to what you consider a trophy oh well KMA...
Every deer harvested, I consider a trophy to a degree, but I can't bring myself to harvest any buck that is smaller then the last one I took, its just to easy. When someone is practicing QDM, or even TDM for that matter they have to set some size or age standards for bucks harvested on the property, surely you can't fault a land owner/manager for that?  You would love to kill giant bucks, but harvest any small buck that walks by? Kinda sounds like your hunting methods are  counter productive.  If Bill Jorden invited you to one of his whitetail hunting ranches, and told you to harvest a mature 150" or larger buck, would you shoot a yearling buck? 

 If I am paying for a hunt I plan on killing a trophy buck since I would be paying to do just that. Its as simple as that. When I hunt open range land like most of us have to do here I shoot what ever animal I feel the need to kill. I will not apologies to anyone for killing a deer they consider too "small". And for the record if I was invited to hunt someones land and they want me to kill a trophy buck I would do just that..I just dont hunt for horns.
Wheat is harvested, Animals are killed...

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JPH
 
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RE: Les Davenport-changed is belief?

Postby JPH » Mon Sep 08, 2008 9:33 am

This is one of the reasons I prefer to hunt alone. I set my own expectations and I answer only to myself (and the game regs). Hunting with others and trying to hold to a "standard" can be tricky.
 
Example: I took a friend out on a doe hunt last year. The last thing I said to him as we headed to our stands was, "Try to avoid fawns, because I don't want to kill any button bucks." Two hours later I was watching a lone doe feed in the corner of the field. I glassed her for a minute and took a solid shot at about 60 yds. When I recovered "her" it had nubs. I had done exactly what I had told him not to do! I really thought it was a yearling doe before shooting. You can immagine how embarassed I was when we met at the truck. Luckally he was pretty easy on me.

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EatDeer
 
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RE: Les Davenport-changed is belief?

Postby EatDeer » Mon Sep 08, 2008 1:49 pm

ORIGINAL: gutpile

ORIGINAL: EatDeer

ORIGINAL: gutpile

First off if a guy talked to me like that, he wouldn't do it twice..
And I will have to agree with 480 on this issue..People have turned deer hunting into a chest beating frenzy, all the is talk about P&Y and B&C, like you have to have a deer score in order for it to be a trophy, I would love to kill giant bucks and bulls, that's why I hunt hard, I have taken a fair share of good deer & elk, but i make the decision when I see the animal if I am gonna kill it, and if it doesn't measure up to what you consider a trophy oh well KMA...
Every deer harvested, I consider a trophy to a degree, but I can't bring myself to harvest any buck that is smaller then the last one I took, its just to easy. When someone is practicing QDM, or even TDM for that matter they have to set some size or age standards for bucks harvested on the property, surely you can't fault a land owner/manager for that?  You would love to kill giant bucks, but harvest any small buck that walks by? Kinda sounds like your hunting methods are  counter productive.  If Bill Jorden invited you to one of his whitetail hunting ranches, and told you to harvest a mature 150" or larger buck,  would you shoot a yearling buck? 

If I am paying for a hunt I plan on killing a trophy buck since I would be paying to do just that. Its as simple as that. When I hunt open range land like most of us have to do here I shoot what ever animal I feel the need to kill. I will not apologies to anyone for killing a deer they consider too "small". And for the record if I was invited to hunt someones land and they want me to kill a trophy buck I would do just that..I just dont hunt for horns.
So its safe to say you will harvest any young buck, unless the landowner asks you not to shoot young bucks. Why shouldnt Les be granted the same respect, or other landowners, and hunters who practice QDM.    If your not "horn hunting" shouldn't you be shooting doe's, instead of the young bucks. Looks to me like it's a double standard way of thinking.
"Let a young buck go, so he can grow."

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EatDeer
 
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RE: Les Davenport-changed is belief?

Postby EatDeer » Mon Sep 08, 2008 1:55 pm

ORIGINAL: JPH

This is one of the reasons I prefer to hunt alone. I set my own expectations and I answer only to myself (and the game regs). Hunting with others and trying to hold to a "standard" can be tricky.

Example: I took a friend out on a doe hunt last year. The last thing I said to him as we headed to our stands was, "Try to avoid fawns, because I don't want to kill any button bucks." Two hours later I was watching a lone doe feed in the corner of the field. I glassed her for a minute and took a solid shot at about 60 yds. When I recovered "her" it had nubs. I had done exactly what I had told him not to do! I really thought it was a yearling doe before shooting. You can immagine how embarassed I was when we met at the truck. Luckally he was pretty easy on me.
Accidents happen, nobody is going to blame you for that. Hunting alone is ok, but it's meant to be shared with friends and famliy.
"Let a young buck go, so he can grow."

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JPH
 
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RE: Les Davenport-changed is belief?

Postby JPH » Mon Sep 08, 2008 2:09 pm

ORIGINAL: EatDeer
 Hunting alone is ok, but it's meant to be shared with friends and famliy.

 
The truth is, nobody really wants to deer hunt with me. I can be a little...high strung, when it comes to deer hunting. Shure makes those long drags tough. [:@]
 
But come turkey season, I'm Mr. Popular b/c I'm more relaxed and I'm a decent caller. [;)]

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