Ithaca Deerslayer 12 gage...Sabot's?

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Headrush
 
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Ithaca Deerslayer 12 gage...Sabot's?

Postby Headrush » Wed Jul 22, 2009 2:23 pm

Whats up guys/gals? New guy here...first time postig here and I'd first like to say good luck to everyone this year. Be safe

I bought an Ithaca 12 gage pump gun last year from a guy at work. Has the rifled barrel and I was hoping to set it up for treestand hunting. I have an 870 I love for pushes and still hunting. Anyway I bought Remington Copper solids (2-3/4"), Sabot Slugs, but they were so hot they wouldn't eject without really giving me a workout. The casings seem to be expanding and even though they load easy like sluggers in my 870 do, it just doesn't want to come out after a round is fired.

I figured the best thing I could do is buy 3-4 boxes of Sabots from different manufacturers and try them to see what it likes. Got 1 box of Lightfield's now but its tough to find slugs this time of year and at $15/box of 5 I want to pick the right ones.

Do any of you have a Mid-70's Ithaca Deerslayer 12ga. that likes a certain sabot slug?

Thanks to everyone in advance!

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shaman
 
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RE: Ithaca Deerslayer 12 gage...Sabot's?

Postby shaman » Thu Jul 23, 2009 4:59 am

One of the problems you will face in your quest is that it is impossible to tell what will work in your individual firearm until you try it.  This is the most true with sabots, but also true with standard slugs.  There is huge variability in this every step of the way. Some even find that  this year's ammo shoots well and next year's lot doesn't work at all.  Sabots just exacerbate the situation.

Your plan to buy several boxes of different stuff and try it is dead on.  My advice is as soon as you find one that works, buy up as much as you can of that lot and shoot off it for several seasons.  It will save you a bunch of money down the road, because you won't have to go back and redo your pre-season testing. 

There was a thread on this sort of thing quite recently:

http://forum.deeranddeerhunting.com/tm.aspx?m=39943

One other hint:  with standard slugs it is a bit easier to find a round that works. 
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Headrush
 
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RE: Ithaca Deerslayer 12 gage...Sabot's?

Postby Headrush » Thu Jul 23, 2009 3:27 pm

Thanks!

I'm going to buy a few boxes and fire away

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RE: Ithaca Deerslayer 12 gage...Sabot's?

Postby CB on the run » Fri Jul 24, 2009 5:36 am

A mid 1970's Ithaca is not going to have a rifled barrel unless it's after market or a more recent purchase from Ithaca. I'm not trying to be smart but rather give you accurate information. The early after market Hastings rifled barrels will become damaged from copper solid slugs and are not recommended. The rate of twist is important to know in your barrel. A slower twist like 1:35 usually shoots better with sabots in the 1400-1600 fps range. A quicker twist can usually stablize the faster sabots that most major manufactures are now promoting.
Lightfield's have shot well from most of my slug guns but seldom leave an exit hole. I personally prefer 2 holes in deer for the best blood trail possible. Currently I shoot Federal barnes expanders(original,large hollowpoint) from both my slug guns, however, I will be testing a couple new brands from the 20ga. They may not work in your gun. Your on the right track testing numerous brands to find out what your gun likes.
I would find out what type and rate of twist your barrel has first. Give it a very good cleaning. Bore brush with J&B bore cleaner, numerous patches with Hoppes/Shooters Choice/Butches bore cleaner then repeat several times until the clean white patch stays exactly that way-clean. Then a very light coat of Kroil then another dry patch. Take her to the range on a calm cool morning with some cleaning supplies. Sandbag her and take 5-10 honest minutes between shots. Clean her with boresnake or such every 4-5 shots. Sight her dead on at 75 yards. Good luck.

CB

ps Remington Copper solids are made for your 870. Something is wrong if they are not ejecting from your gun. I would take the gun and a spent case to a reputable gunsmith.

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Headrush
 
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RE: Ithaca Deerslayer 12 gage...Sabot's?

Postby Headrush » Thu Aug 06, 2009 3:37 pm

Sorry I wasn't clear...I'm having problems ejecting the Remington Copper Solids from my Ithaca. The 870 is my other shotgun that I've used for years but its a smooth, buck barrel...no rifling in that gun.

I tried to look up the serial number(?) above the trigger on the Ithaca's receiver, but found nothing on the web. Not sure why, but I thought that i might be able to see when it was made. Going on hearsay at this point unfortunately.

I took the barrel off and it is a rifled "M-87-Featherlight chambered for 2 3/4" 12 gage"
No visible obstructions or damage of any kind that I could see with a good light.

I only fired 2 Remington Copper Solids through it, but I'll give it a good cleaning and try a couple of these other brands I picked up:

Winchester - Super X Sabot Slugs 1.0 oz., 1350 FPS
Lightfield - Hybred EXP Exoanding Nose Sabot Slug 1 1/4 oz (546 gr), 1454 FPS
Lightfield Lites - Reduced Recoil Hybrid EXP 1 1/4 oz (546 gr), 1300 FPS
Hornady - SST Shotgun Slug 300 gr, 2000 FPS**

The Remington Copper Solids were 1450 FPS, and seemed to expand so should I try to stick with a slower slug? Does a larger slug mean a lighter powder charge?

I also re-read an old article in a D & DH mag about slug guns. It said the Ithaca deerslayers were typically 1-28 twist and they would prefer the faster slugs around 1450 FPS and up. Maybe the Hornady's will be the best performer at 2000 FPS? Too fast?

Please keep the comments coming. I'd like to get a few rounds through it by next weekend, so hopefully I'll get somethng figured out. If the next few rounds jam I'll head right to the gunsmith.

CB on the run
 
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RE: Ithaca Deerslayer 12 gage...Sabot's?

Postby CB on the run » Fri Aug 07, 2009 4:12 am

If the gun is a 70's vintage then the barrel was added afterwards which is fine. Ithaca barrels, I believe, are all 1:35. A lot depends on the bore tolerance since Ithaca has gone through several owners. The better the bore grips the sabot the better accuracy in theory.
A larger or heavier slug doesn't mean a reduced powder charge. Manufactures tend to load towards maximum limits but it's all about chamber pressure.
Maybe you bought a bad batch of copper solids that didn't have the brass sized. Are they all from the same lot#?
Hornady's slug shot well from my Remington 1100 20ga even though it has a 1:35 Hastings rifled barrel on it. They may have even grouped slightly better than the Barnes expanders but I have a large inventory of the expanders plus I love how they preform on deer.
Since you're in your testing phase and not seemingly committed to one brand, I would not overlook the new Remington Accu-tip. I have not tested this slug and originally thought it was nothing more than a marketing ploy but have since read many good thing about this slug. It came out on top in accuracy in a recent test.  I also seen Wichester BRI sabot shoot extremely well from several guns but I think they were both bolt action rifled slug guns. Good luck and let us know how you do.

CB

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Headrush
 
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RE: Ithaca Deerslayer 12 gage...Sabot's?

Postby Headrush » Sun Aug 09, 2009 4:38 am

Thanks for all the help and info CB. I had a wedding to go to this weekend and its raining out now so it'll be a couple days before I shoot.

What is the best way to determine what twist I have in my rifled barrel? That seems like the first thing I need to figure out

CB on the run
 
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RE: Ithaca Deerslayer 12 gage...Sabot's?

Postby CB on the run » Mon Aug 10, 2009 6:09 am

If it's an Ithaca barrel and was made in New York it should be 1:35. I think they're in Ohio now. I sent them an email recently asking a question about their 20ga ultra light and had a response in 48 hours. They seem eager to help. They may have a toll free number on their web site, I'm not sure and sort of streched for time today.

CB

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Headrush
 
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RE: Ithaca Deerslayer 12 gage...Sabot's?

Postby Headrush » Sun Oct 04, 2009 7:47 am

OK so I went to the range yesterday and shot 15 sabot slugs through this gun. None of them were jamming which was great to see. must have been somethig to do with the Remington Copper Solids? bad batch or something? or maybe something else? Anyway...the slugs I shot were the Lightfield's and the Winchesters.

Got it on paper but will have to dial it in at 100 yds now after giving it a good cleaning.

Thanks for the help. Good luck this year

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rem700
 
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RE: Ithaca Deerslayer 12 gage...Sabot's?

Postby rem700 » Mon Oct 05, 2009 7:44 am

It sounds like to me the remington copper solids have to much pressure for that gun. shounld not be hard to remove the fired hull. may need to clean the shotgun to  
Robert


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