What should i do?

Your place to discuss ways the habitats for deer can be improved!
sfraider51
 
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RE: What should i do?

Postby sfraider51 » Sun Aug 10, 2008 3:25 pm

these types of things you cant overthink, yes if you have acces to a tractor and all the equipment you need then by all means plant food plots. but im sure you have school and other things to worry about throughout most of the year, so just try a few simple things, one day put on your waterproof boots and make your way down the creek, that way you will leave very little tracks scent and signs you were there. find areas where the deer dont have to bend down so much to get a drink, make sure the area isnt boxed in but has enough cover where a deer can monitor his surroundings yet feel safe. set up your stand or groundblind on the opposite side of the creek and maybe try putting out a little bit of corn around that area. do as little clearing of trees on the deers side of the creek but as much as you need on your side without making your stand or blond obvious. remember ONLY hunt this spot when the wind is in your favor(blowing into your face). IF you have a trail cam this is optimal time to use it, even if your spot isnt used by big grandaddy bucks you'll see deer and most likely many other critters with a little thirst. you need to realize you are very lucky with the use to this land. use google earth and find out what your neighbors land looks like,if your neighbors have deer forage such as foodplots your at a small disadvantage. work your advantages like the creek or thick bedding areas, my land is all timber but my nieghbors is a enormous foodplot, while we see more big deer on the plot we its harder to get a shot. we've killed more big bucks. but anyways if your neighbor has a foodplot he obviously hunts, if there is more hunting pressure on his land than yours then your in big buisiness. after establishing your stands and plots dont come back to this place, leave it alone as much as possible untill season. the first few times you hunt do it from the ground, your goal here isnt really to kill something but you need to find the trails they're using to enter and exit their foods. find about 3 of these different trails and sit at them about 30 mintues each to find shooting lanes and clear them immediatly, choose lanes that require no more than breaking branches. clear only too one at each side of your view the left and right. this should be done in 1 to 2 days. now you have 4 locations plus wtever you already have and use for your plots, it may be hard to not hunt your favorite spot but only hunt a location if the wind is right, it will pay off i promise
tuck

vambo991
 
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RE: What should i do?

Postby vambo991 » Wed Aug 13, 2008 5:40 pm

If I had to plant one thing... it would be a late season oat plot... not kidding.

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ohiohunter
 
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RE: What should i do?

Postby ohiohunter » Wed Aug 13, 2008 5:45 pm

i recently got my cam photos back and only had one pic of a small buck with a lot of pics of does and fawns. my plots are starting to come together but with myself having soccer every night and school starting soon i am running out of time. i put up my first stand about 45 yards from the creek by a large trail. i also hope to set up about 3 more sets. the only problem i am having is finding the perfect set in the transition zone between the bedding area and the food without spooking all the deer. after the season starts the woods just fills up with deer but they all spook when i try to enter the woods no matter where i enter from. any ideas? thanks for everything so far.

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dtrain56
 
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RE: What should I do?

Postby dtrain56 » Thu Aug 14, 2008 2:05 pm

Well i will be the devils advocate...what if they only have this one time to hunt and they enjoy eating venision...they may not care about rack size...it is all the same in the skillet...
 
 
I have buddies that hunt for only antlers....they try each year to out do them selves with a bigger rack
 
presonally i dont care about out doing myself i would rather have deer jerky and burgers
 
If i killed a large racked buck that would be great but i really enjoy eating it and preparing my food plots as i do the kill.
 
I do practice some management but i'm not going to go crazy, if its out to the tips of ears it is going down... cause if i don't get enough to give everyone in the family venesion jerky for chritmas the misses will be pissed and i might not get to see misses clause in her santa outfit!!!!!

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JPH
 
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RE: What should I do?

Postby JPH » Sat Aug 16, 2008 3:51 am

ORIGINAL: dtrain56

Well i will be the devils advocate...what if they only have this one time to hunt and they enjoy eating venision...they may not care about rack size...it is all the same in the skillet...


I have buddies that hunt for only antlers....they try each year to out do them selves with a bigger rack

presonally i dont care about out doing myself i would rather have deer jerky and burgers

If i killed a large racked buck that would be great but i really enjoy eating it and preparing my food plots as i do the kill.

I do practice some management but i'm not going to go crazy, if its out to the tips of ears it is going down... cause if i don't get enough to give everyone in the family venesion jerky for chritmas the misses will be pissed and i might not get to see misses clause in her santa outfit!!!!!

 
So why not shoot does?
 
There are hunters who accuse QDMers of being antler crazed, then they turn around and argure that their hunting licance gives them the "right" to shoot yearling bucks.
 
Kind of the pot calling the kettle balck isn't it?

msbadger
 
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RE: What should I do?

Postby msbadger » Sun Aug 17, 2008 4:14 am

JPH..thats not calling the kettle blk...thier liecense does give the right to choose a yearling buck with in the perimeters of the law...ya know I have the head of a very nice 6pt buck hanging in a tree near the garage...it's been there for 5yrs now...he was a buck that I past on opening morning of shot gun...his G-2 were 9in. long and the rack wide...and I saw potential...but it was 5min into to season as well...he walked under my stand and 5 min later I hear bang!....A month later I found him in the creek behind our place and 70 yrds from the guys next doors stand...the guy shot and never got out of his stand to even check to see if he hit it...I know..I asked him...before showing him the head....It's a reminder that his life wouldn't have been wasted if I had not been looking for a bigger deer...I don't go out and shoot the first deer I see because of this but it reminds me that their are guys out there so caught up in antler size that if they shoot a buck and then find it's not the "trophy" they thought it was...or theyed been "watching " all summer they will let it lay and continue to hunt...and thats the problem with "trophy" hunting...there are more of those "guys" out there than any of us want to or will admitt....Don't loose track of what a real hunter is or hunt is.

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JPH
 
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RE: What should I do?

Postby JPH » Sun Aug 17, 2008 4:42 am

ORIGINAL: msbadger

JPH..thats not calling the kettle blk...thier liecense does give the right to choose a yearling buck with in the perimeters of the law...ya know I have the head of a very nice 6pt buck hanging in a tree near the garage...it's been there for 5yrs now...he was a buck that I past on opening morning of shot gun...his G-2 were 9in. long and the rack wide...and I saw potential...but it was 5min into to season as well...he walked under my stand and 5 min later I hear bang!....A month later I found him in the creek behind our place and 70 yrds from the guys next doors stand...the guy shot and never got out of his stand to even check to see if he hit it...I know..I asked him...before showing him the head....It's a reminder that his life wouldn't have been wasted if I had not been looking for a bigger deer...I don't go out and shoot the first deer I see because of this but it reminds me that their are guys out there so caught up in antler size that if they shoot a buck and then find it's not the "trophy" they thought it was...or theyed been "watching " all summer they will let it lay and continue to hunt...and thats the problem with "trophy" hunting...there are more of those "guys" out there than any of us want to or will admitt....Don't loose track of what a real hunter is or hunt is.

 
We differ on "right vs. privelage", but let's use the phrase "right" in order to continue on common ground.
 
If one's tag conveys a right to shoot any legal buck, then it also conveys a responsability. That responsability means doing what is best for the herd in the process of filling the freezer.
 
If it is all about meat, then why not shoot a doe. If it is about getting a set of antlers, no matter how small, then stop accusing those who aim for older bucks of being "trophy" hunters. 
 
Your story of the poaced 6 point is compelling. But I do not take the moral to be that you should have rolled that yearling yourself. I find myself thinking about what a jackass your neighbor is and I wonder how many does you (and he) passed on before the season closed.
 
I guess my position boils down to this. If you hold one any deer tag and want to take the first good shot that presents, go for it. I will continue to back regulations that increase the chances of yearling bucks surviving that encounter (late gun seasons, 1 buck limits, APR's, etc.). But if you pass on does with that tag, in order to shoot a yearling buck, then you too suffer from antler illness.

Legnip
 
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RE: What should I do?

Postby Legnip » Sun Aug 17, 2008 5:27 am

I don't know if there are any right or wrong answers on this one. It is hard to have a QDM without at least a bunch of land to manage or like minded groups of people. Antlers are nice, but they make a thin soup. I would rather shoot a doe than a small buck. That is just my personal preference. I've seen what an over harvest of the young bucks and no harvest of the does will do to the herd. Everything gets screwed up and the quality goes down. WI added a nice but un-intended side affect to the annual harvest in some areas that required you to earn a buck by shooting a doe first. It let a lot of little bucks get a year older. I don't think it would be effective if the gun season season was longer than 9 days. I think that this is more effective than a 4 or 6 point restriction, since it lets everyone make a choice on what type of buck they want to harvest. I think Quality Deer and Trophy deer mean something different to us all.
From those who much is given, much is expected

msbadger
 
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RE: What should I do?

Postby msbadger » Sun Aug 17, 2008 9:42 am

JPH...first don't get me wrong...I do shoot doe....it's been many a year where a doe or 4 I've shot....but I'm much more concerned in my area how many and what size doe I take...I'm lucky in that because the DEC gives out huge amounts of doe permits and I have several places other than at home to hunt...I can take care in what needs culling and what doesn't....Not all that are handed a doe permit do this...there is such thing as killing off TOO many doe in an area and it's happened here a few times....DEC is handing out 27000 more doe tags in our area than last year...It's a big area but here....... where we are over run with hunters all grouped together...it will I have no doubts ...damage this herd...you want more and better education then you need to start with herd improvement ...not just buck ratios.....I can tell when the herds out of wack....the woods tell me ...but how many hunters do you know really know how to read their hunting property?....It's not all about counting deer....it's the knowledge of natural browse or lack of the under story ...are your seedlings mowed down or growing...not mistaking that for deer verse wood management...ect..ect
 As far as accusing anyone of any thing...upon reading what I said...I suppose it applies to doe's the shoe fit...to whom ever read it...Lets be honest for a moment...how many "guys" get their wives to take a saftey course just to get that extra tag...then get rid of that first shot gitters with that tag so they feel comfortable taking the "Big" boy...unfortunately ...I know of way too many of them...it's always the "wife " that shot that 5 or 6 pt.....OOhh lordy I know ...sshhh don't talk about it ...the anti's are reading ....geeez
 I've also have in the past said.... in this area.... I think pt. restrictions would be a good thing...safety reasons first...but is that going to stop the loss of young buck...no...why because with all that doe hunting way too many button buck are taken ...well it looked bigger than I thought when shooting at a doe...how many times have any of us heard that one......Until there is real education out there and we start policing our selves as ethical hunters...I still think it's a hunters right in general to choose.

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JPH
 
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RE: What should I do?

Postby JPH » Sun Aug 17, 2008 1:03 pm

ORIGINAL: msbadger

...I do shoot doe....it's been many a year where a doe or 4 I've shot
 
....but I'm much more concerned in my area how many and what size doe I take...
 
...I can take care in what needs culling and what doesn't
 
...there is such thing as killing off TOO many doe in an area
 
...you want more and better education then you need to start with herd improvement ...not just buck ratios
 
...I can tell when the herds out of wack....the woods tell me
 
...but how many hunters do you know really know how to read their hunting property
 
...It's not all about counting deer
 
...it's the knowledge of natural browse or lack of the under story ...are your seedlings mowed down or growing...not mistaking that for deer verse wood management...ect..ect

... I think pt. restrictions would be a good thing...safety reasons first
 
...well it looked bigger than I thought when shooting at a doe...how many times have any of us heard that one
 
...Until there is real education out there and we start policing our selves as ethical hunters...I still think it's a hunters right in general to choose.

 
^^ Please forgive the edit.
 
Funny, I've been trying to defend QDM on this forum for a couple of years. And in rebutting one of my posts, you have made a better pro-QDM argument than I ever have. Thanks!
 

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