Approx score of Antlers??

[JPH]

ORIGINAL: ranwin33

My feeling is that you can have different levels of committment to QDM and that people who shoot 2.5's don't have the same committment as someone who is willing to pass until a buck reaches 5.5. Sure they may both be practicing QDM, but one guy is much more into it than the other.

That's your opinion, so you certainly have the right  to express it, but I totally disagree.

The person with the greatest commitment to QDM is the one who does the most work to on doe harvest, herd monitoring, education and who finds the buck harvest restriction that best fits his situation.

I also feel that the hunter who has the best chance of advancing QDM is the one who respects that we all come into this with different goals and resources. QDM is not one size-fits all. And if it is, you can have it because I want out!

[CB on the run]

What I find dishearting on this forum is the number of people willing to argue a point or issue. QDM has many different meanings to many people. I don't believe there is one right answer. Everyone has a right to their own opinion and to express it when someone asks for input.
QDM to me means a quest for larger bucks within the area I have some sort of control over. But my neighbor might want more deer regardless or size or antlers. Who's wrong. IMO neither, they're both right. In areas with smaller land parcels QDM has a ring of cooperation among numerous land owner who agree on a common goal for the area. I know several common one in the Northeast and they are "does are off limits period" no matter how many are on the property and the second is "the rack has to be wider than the ears" no matter how many points or what it scores. Who is to say neither is QDM?
The thread started was asking for guesses on what the rack might score. Maybe he's undecided on whether or not he should attempt to harvest this deer. Whether or not someone includes their opinion about such harvest would not be considered out of place for the question poised and therefore, IMO, should not anger or upset anyone.
BTW, 118".

CB

[ranwin33]

ORIGINAL: JPH

That's your opinion, so you certainly have the right  to express it, but I totally disagree.

The person with the greatest commitment to QDM is the one who does the most work to on doe harvest, herd monitoring, education and who finds the buck harvest restriction that best fits his situation.

I also feel that the hunter who has the best chance of advancing QDM is the one who respects that we all come into this with different goals and resources. QDM is not one size-fits all. And if it is, you can have it because I want out!

At least we can agree that there can be different levels of committment to QDM - and I would agree that someone as you describe has a very high level of committement to QDM.  I don't know that I'd say it was the "greatest" commitment to QDM, but certainly a very high level. 
 
But I would also stand by my statement that someone who is working on improving the age structure of the deer herd is also more committed than someone who isn't, i.e. shooting 2.5 year old bucks.
 
While QDM is not one size fits all, it does still encompass certain standards and to say you are practicing QDM if you do not practice those standards; herd management, habitat management, hunter management and herd monitoring than a person is only fooling themselves.

[ranwin33]

ORIGINAL: CB on the run

...Whether or not someone includes their opinion about such harvest would not be considered out of place for the question poised and therefore, IMO, should not anger or upset anyone.
BTW, 118".

CB

You make a great point here CB.
 
We as hunters live by a long list of shoulds:
 
We should -
[ul][*]practice with our bows before the season begins.
[*]make sure our broadheads are sharp.
[*]where a safety harness when in a treestand.
[*]sight our rifles in after traveling or when we get into camp.
[*]practice shooting our rifles before the season begins.
[*]pactice scent control.
[*]hunt downwind of where we expect to see deer.
[*]use the appropriate bullet caliber for the game we hunt.
[*]check our treestands to make sure they're safe.
[*]let people know where it is we're hunting and what our schedules are.
[*]follow the laws of the state where we hunt.
[*]track wounded game until we've exhausted all efforts to find it.
[*]respect our neighbors boundaries and stay within our property lines.
[*]be sure of our target before we shoot.
[*]take only ethical shots.
[*]etc. etc.[/ul]
And we're all good with that, even if we don't agree.  Nobody gets too bent out of shape over these things. 
 
But the minute someone says you should shoot this deer, or you should let this deer walk, well we get all up in arms about people telling other people what to do.  It is disheartening, especially given this entire forum is built around a bunch of people telling other people their opinions.

[Patriot]

ORIGINAL: ranwin33

But the minute someone says you should shoot this deer, or you should let this deer walk, well we get all up in arms about people telling other people what to do.  It is disheartening, especially given this entire forum is built around a bunch of people telling other people their opinions.

 
Great point ranwin33,
My issue is with the authoritative tone used by some folks when expressing their opinion.  Sometimes it comes across as fact when it is simply an opinion.
 
I enjoy a healthy debate, but have a tough time when people come across as though their way is the only way.
 

[coach]

Good mass......Good height....Good tine length.....but not very wide.
Great buck....would love to get a chance as something identical.
 
I say max 120. 
 
But then again.....I know for a fact that 4 + 4  = 6. 

[JPH]

ORIGINAL: ranwin33

ORIGINAL: JPH

That's your opinion, so you certainly have the right  to express it, but I totally disagree.

The person with the greatest commitment to QDM is the one who does the most work to on doe harvest, herd monitoring, education and who finds the buck harvest restriction that best fits his situation.

I also feel that the hunter who has the best chance of advancing QDM is the one who respects that we all come into this with different goals and resources. QDM is not one size-fits all. And if it is, you can have it because I want out!

At least we can agree that there can be different levels of committment to QDM - and I would agree that someone as you describe has a very high level of committement to QDM.  I don't know that I'd say it was the "greatest" commitment to QDM, but certainly a very high level. 

But I would also stand by my statement that someone who is working on improving the age structure of the deer herd is also more committed than someone who isn't, i.e. shooting 2.5 year old bucks.

While QDM is not one size fits all, it does still encompass certain standards and to say you are practicing QDM if you do not practice those standards; herd management, habitat management, hunter management and herd monitoring than a person is only fooling themselves.

You know, I am slowly coming full circle on QDM. At one point I was one of the most vocal supporters of it on this forum. But as I go along, I find my ideas on the issue being more and more at odds with other QDMers. It is almost like a religion for some people!

Listen to us! We're arguing about who has the greatest commitment to QDM. Not God. Not conservation. Not our country. QDM! That's an argument I will gladly let you and others win. If shooting a 2.5 year old buck, or supporting another hunter in doing so makes me less of a QDMer, than I'll just stop using the phrase alltogether. I can think of many other things I would rather be know for.

Look for a new thread on this topic, as i think this is far from what the OP here was looking for.

[ranwin33]

ORIGINAL: JPH

You know, I am slowly coming full circle on QDM. At one point I was one of the most vocal supporters of it on this forum. But as I go along, I find my ideas on the issue being more and more at odds with other QDMers. It is almost like a religion for some people!

Listen to us! We're arguing about who has the greatest commitment to QDM. Not God. Not conservation. Not our country. QDM! That's an argument I will gladly let you and others win. If shooting a 2.5 year old buck, or supporting another hunter in doing so makes me less of a QDMer, than I'll just stop using the phrase alltogether. I can think of many other things I would rather be know for.

Look for a new thread on this topic, as i think this is far from what the OP here was looking for.

 
You know, there is nothing wrong with having ideas that are at odds with others - if we were all the same life would be pretty boring.  That's one of the reasons I enjoy your posts, even if we don't see eye-to-eye, you always give a pretty well reasoned defense of your point of view - without getting personal or negative about things, and I feel I always take something positive away from the discussions. 
 
But I don't think we're arguing about anything here, we're just providing our own points of view on the subject, and when it comes down to what we believe we should be doing for our properties we're most likely more alike than less.
 
Looking forward to the new thread.
 

[schlupis]

ORIGINAL: JPH

ORIGINAL: ranwin33

ORIGINAL: JPH

That's your opinion, so you certainly have the right  to express it, but I totally disagree.

The person with the greatest commitment to QDM is the one who does the most work to on doe harvest, herd monitoring, education and who finds the buck harvest restriction that best fits his situation.

I also feel that the hunter who has the best chance of advancing QDM is the one who respects that we all come into this with different goals and resources. QDM is not one size-fits all. And if it is, you can have it because I want out!

At least we can agree that there can be different levels of committment to QDM - and I would agree that someone as you describe has a very high level of committement to QDM.  I don't know that I'd say it was the "greatest" commitment to QDM, but certainly a very high level. 

But I would also stand by my statement that someone who is working on improving the age structure of the deer herd is also more committed than someone who isn't, i.e. shooting 2.5 year old bucks.

While QDM is not one size fits all, it does still encompass certain standards and to say you are practicing QDM if you do not practice those standards; herd management, habitat management, hunter management and herd monitoring than a person is only fooling themselves.

Listen to us! We're arguing about who has the greatest commitment to QDM. Not God. Not conservation. Not our country. QDM! That's an argument I will gladly let you and others win. If shooting a 2.5 year old buck, or supporting another hunter in doing so makes me less of a QDMer, than I'll just stop using the phrase alltogether. I can think of many other things I would rather be know for.

JPH I have stopped using the term QDM shortly after joining this forum. There is IMO no exact right way, to do QDM. I sometimes dont know why I joined after getting into some of these pointless arguments. I do know that I practice (SDM) Schlupis deer managment on our properties. It has worked pretty well for us. I think those three letters QDM have in some ways hurt hunting. What I mean is it has turned some hunters against each other and taken some of the fun out of hunting. Perfect example is this thread, it turned into a big pissing match between sides.

Right or wrong this is what we do on our properties. We plant about 7 acres of the 200 acres, in food plots for deer Turkey and grouse, planning on expanding to 10 acres when money comes around. The food plots have something in them for the wildlife during each of the 4 seasons. we have clear cut areas to make room for new growth. We kill a few does each year and atleast one buck 3.5 or older a year. For me I dont want to shoot a buck unless I am going to put it on the wall that is just me, sometimes that wallhanger is a 2.5 yr old I am ok with that but I try to stay away from 2.5's. I have 4 children that are growing up in a deer hunting family and I am not going to pass on to them a tradition that only allows the taking of big bucks for fear of pissing off some other hunter, thats what happened to me, I will let them make that decision for themselves. I just want them to be happy and hunting with Dad. To me thats all that really matters.

So I will end by saying good luck to everybody this season and kill whatever makes you happy and god bless.

[Goose]

I actually thought we had a pretty good discussion going......off base-yes, but good none the less[:D]