What dont some people get about QDM

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schlupis
 
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RE: What dont some people get about QDM

Postby schlupis » Fri Dec 05, 2008 2:40 am

JPH I have to say I am struggling to understand your example of your neighbor. Either he is participating in QDM or he isnt. For me I dont like it when I hear people say I am into QDM when they are seeing big deer and killing them, then when the first season comes along where they arent seeing the big ones like they were before they get frusterated and then shoot a smaller buck just to satisfy their need to kill a buck.
 
Now I would never talk down on sombody who kills a small buck. I will however ask them why they shot a smaller buck when they claim to be in QDM or trying to manage their land for bigger bucks. The usual answer is just like your example I was frusterated I am having a bad year and I needed to kill something, that never sits well with me.
 
I am not saying I am a QDM Pro I am just saying I set out to only take deer that are 3.5 or older have I killed deer that were 2.5 yes but not because I was frusterated with my season but because I misjudged the age of the deer. No regrets on that either.  But in the seasons were I have been struggling to find the older deer (like this season) not once has it cross my mind to shoot the smaller bucks that I have seen some of which were 8 pointers with around a 15 inch inside spread. I have a set standard for what I want to kill and I will not and have not ever changed that standard just to fill a tag.
 
Not trying to ruffle feathers here this is just my opinion maybe my brand of hunting falls more into TDM than QDM.

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ranwin33
 
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RE: What dont some people get about QDM

Postby ranwin33 » Fri Dec 05, 2008 4:08 am

I think he said his neighbor had several bad seasons in a row, not just one.  If I had hunted several seasons in a row without shooting a deer, my ideas of what qualifies as a shootable buck might change, but I'd also have to look at what I might be doing wrong that I can't get a least one older age class deer to stick around.
 
As for QDM or TDM I don't see anything wrong with either.  If you're managing for trophies, then your also managing for quality deer - you're just placing even great restrictions on what you shoot.  I know a lot of people look poorly on the idea of TDM, but I think the book Whitetail Advantage does a good job of explaining it in a palatable fasion. 
 
If you are practicing TDM I say more power to you and I hope you are successful.
“There are two spiritual dangers in not owning a farm. One is the danger of supposing that breakfast comes from the grocery, and the other that heat comes from the furnace.”
Aldo Leopold

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dmcianfa
 
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RE: What dont some people get about QDM

Postby dmcianfa » Fri Dec 05, 2008 4:32 am

I get the "i havn;t got any bucks yet and/or only one or two under my belt" so shooting a less mature buck is O.K. in my book, especially for a young hunter just getting started in the pasttime. 

But if he/she has taken mature bucks before and this was only a satisfaction shoot or a filling the freezer thing, then why wouldn't he/she shoot a doe to fulfill the need to overcome his fever or feel like there was accomplishment in the act?  After all, shooting does is another facet of QDM as well to keep a well balanced herd and it gives a hunter plenty of practice when shooting big game on one's property, no?
"I enjoy and become completely immersed in the challenge and the increased opportunity to become for a time a part of nature. Deer hunting is a classical exercise in freedom. It�s a return to fundamentals that I distinctly feel are basic and right"-F.B.

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ranwin33
 
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RE: What dont some people get about QDM

Postby ranwin33 » Fri Dec 05, 2008 5:15 am

Shooting a doe is always an option, and I would hope the first option anyone practicing QDM makes. 
 
But if a legal buck walked under my stand, and I hadn't shot a deer in several seasons, and I had not had any previous opportunities to take a doe that season, then sure I'd most likely shoot the buck.  If after several seasons I haven't shot any bucks, then I've done my part for QDM by not taking young deer for the past several years.
 
Plus who's to say that a smallish eight pointer isn't an older deer, you really can't judge age very well by antler size.  I took one of those this year.
 
Given the limited acreage most of us have, practicing QDM can be difficult at times.  If we backslide on occasion, that is better than not practicing at all.
“There are two spiritual dangers in not owning a farm. One is the danger of supposing that breakfast comes from the grocery, and the other that heat comes from the furnace.”
Aldo Leopold

Nubs
 
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RE: What dont some people get about QDM

Postby Nubs » Fri Dec 05, 2008 5:34 am

I only agree with this to a point. If you own the land, or have exclusive permission to hunt it, then you should reserve the right to change your mind as the season progresses.


This reminds me of my neighbor that I played with as kid. We would begin to play a game and then half way through the game if he was losing he would then change the rules in his favor. He would say it was his house, he can do what he wants.

No body ever sad that when you start QDM you are guaranteed to kill a mature buck every season. I guess I would think that if you have made the step to start QDM, then you are committed to going to the next level in deer hunting and management. That is what I love about the concept, the challenge and commitment that it requires to be successful.

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JPH
 
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RE: What dont some people get about QDM

Postby JPH » Fri Dec 05, 2008 6:25 am

ORIGINAL: schlupis

JPH I have to say I am struggling to understand your example of your neighbor. Either he is participating in QDM or he isnt. For me I dont like it when I hear people say I am into QDM when they are seeing big deer and killing them, then when the first season comes along where they arent seeing the big ones like they were before they get frusterated and then shoot a smaller buck just to satisfy their need to kill a buck.

Now I would never talk down on sombody who kills a small buck. I will however ask them why they shot a smaller buck when they claim to be in QDM or trying to manage their land for bigger bucks. The usual answer is just like your example I was frusterated I am having a bad year and I needed to kill something, that never sits well with me.

I am not saying I am a QDM Pro I am just saying I set out to only take deer that are 3.5 or older have I killed deer that were 2.5 yes but not because I was frusterated with my season but because I misjudged the age of the deer. No regrets on that either.  But in the seasons were I have been struggling to find the older deer (like this season) not once has it cross my mind to shoot the smaller bucks that I have seen some of which were 8 pointers with around a 15 inch inside spread. I have a set standard for what I want to kill and I will not and have not ever changed that standard just to fill a tag.

Not trying to ruffle feathers here this is just my opinion maybe my brand of hunting falls more into TDM than QDM.


I don't where to start, so I'll think I'll take the above post and the one from Nubs and reply with a stream of consciousness and leave it to you to sort out.

If QDM is all about growing bigger bucks, I want out.

If the harvest of a single young buck (for whatever reason) will ruin a QDM program, then it is too fragile to succeed anyway.

Going out on one bow hunt, with the midset that you might settle for a young buck today, does not equate to QDM failure.

If a neighbor were to implemnt all facets of QDM (herd control, habitat improvement, education and monitoring) but leave out the buck restrictions, than he is a great neighbor to have.

My neighbor has planted more trees, passed on more bucks, and harversted more does on his property alone, than most "so called" QDMers have in their whole career.

Buck restrictions must be realistic. Maybe holding to one legal (4 on one antler) buck is a good restriction.

This is supposed to be fun.

I had held to a 3.5 minimum for 5 seasons on my own property. This year i allowed myself to take a 2.5 and loved it. What do you have to say about that? Do I need to turn in my card?

Squirrelhawker
 
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RE: What dont some people get about QDM

Postby Squirrelhawker » Fri Dec 05, 2008 6:37 am

In this season of thanksgiving, I am thankful:
 
That they all taste good.
 
That God makes more of them all the time.
 
That I can reserve the right to change my mind either way as I look through the scope.
 
That in most places, with due diligence, one can find "the right one" to shoot.

cdn1
 
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RE: What dont some people get about QDM

Postby cdn1 » Fri Dec 05, 2008 7:00 am

Sorry guys just wanted to comment on this one. For me and by the look of it QDM is a new concept to alot of us. It is gonna take some time for us all to work out the kinks. What constitutes a quality Whitetail??? for some like the first time deer hunter young or old it might be the first legal deer.
for others it might be the first buck, but for some hunters like myself it is
more about my ability to add something to my hunting partners and my own hunting experience. I am starting to get enjoyment from the idea that
something i do, planting food plots, creating habitat or harvesting more does, adds to how I feel when i climb into my stand. Don't worry too much at how others hunt. I know that it takes more than one person to make a change in a deer population. Lead by example, pass along information/ideas to your neighbours.  I think that trying to hard to manage takes the fun out of what you were trying to do in the first place. Imposeing fines if some one shoots a small buck or giant antler restrictions goes too far especially for the average guy. 
  I want my hunting experience to be exactly that an experience. The sleepless night that you have the night before the season because of the trail cam shots you got of a large deer that feeds in the food plot you planted. The high fives you give you son, brother or friend after they take there first deer whether its a button buck or a huge ten point. If you decide to QDM  then let your hunting community know but they will ultimately decide for themselves what there idea is of a quality deer.
my 2 cents. CDN 1

dxthunter57
 
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RE: What dont some people get about QDM

Postby dxthunter57 » Fri Dec 05, 2008 7:08 am

this is what is happening up here
im 17 and have watched my dad and the other people complain for years that there are no big deer around here
but every person has shot at least one buck if not 2 in one year so he has had good seasons every year
this yeare i went up to everyone and asked that we start a QDM every person i talked to said yes lets do that...and the summer came along and people made food plots
but as opening day of season came 2 yearling deer were shot by the same guy
one in the morning and one in the afternoon

dxthunter57
 
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RE: What dont some people get about QDM

Postby dxthunter57 » Fri Dec 05, 2008 7:14 am

we made restrictions that it had to be at least 3.5 years of age
if it was past its ears and very tall and just a big deer
than yes age didnt matter
the 8 pointer was a yearling deer with great genetics he was inside his ears by about 2 inches
we weighed in it 140 pounds
the 3 point was just tiny it weighed in at 108 pounds

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