NRA News Conference

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Re: NRA News Conference

Postby kellory » Thu Dec 20, 2012 4:31 pm

“No clause in the Constitution could by any rule of construction be conceived to give to congress a power to disarm the people,” Rawle wrote in Chapter X, “OF THE RESTRICTIONS ON THE POWERS OF CONGRESS — AND ON THE EXECUTIVE AND JUDICIAL AUTHORITIES — RESTRICTIONS ON THE POWERS OF STATES AND SECURITY TO THE RIGHTS OF INDIVIDUALS.”

Read more: ... z2FdIRV05b ... a-table-11 ... d-graphic/ ... 618&mode=2 here is a good use of a high cap magazine. You don't want to let them get away. ... screen.pdf

A little light reading.... ;)
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Re: NRA News Conference

Postby kellory » Thu Dec 20, 2012 4:35 pm

Woods Walker wrote:"The gov't already limits civilian weapons and determines which are legal. That train has left the station. My example was machine guns, but you could also include full auto weapons."

YES!!! That's the point! It started when they banned full auto weapons! It was a reaction to the prohibition era booze wars, and the ban on full auto DID NOT stop those killings....the end of prohibition did.

So first the banned full auto. Now they want to ban "evil looking" rifles that are functionallty no different than 90% of the hunting weapons we all use. If they do it will not work either. The will come back looking to deny us of even more of our rights. Like I said, I've been involved in this fight for 44 years and the arguments NEVER, EVER change.

As I understand it, nearly ALL hunting rifles designs started their careers as military weapons. So why is a surprise when they look like military weapons?
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Re: NRA News Conference

Postby JPH » Thu Dec 20, 2012 5:51 pm

Guys, you are my friends. We share a respect for the 2nd Amendment and a thorough knowledge of guns. I will put my record of support for the constitution up for review and I'm confidant it will stand up.

It's just that your arguments are tired and frankly unrealistic. The idea that we should have unrestricted access to massive firepower in the form of extended magazines because we might be forced to engage in prolonged shootouts in our homes and bushiness or to prevent the King of England from quartering troops in our homes just don't stand up to the mounting death toll at the hands of deranged shooters.

If I'm not buying it anymore, I guarantee the general public wont. Gun control is coming. The question is, should we control things in a way that makes sense or should we let Joe Biden do it?

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Re: NRA News Conference

Postby kellory » Thu Dec 20, 2012 5:52 pm

Clips of footage, in an ever changing story. And a little light reading. ... -shooting/
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Re: NRA News Conference

Postby fr0sty » Thu Dec 20, 2012 6:07 pm

C'mon, you seriously believe that?

It's funny, I was talking with someone today about the shooting and said if I ever hear someone say this was a setup to get gun control rolling, that I would have to b'slap whoever said it. Guess I need to get on the road...

kellory wrote:Clips of footage, in an ever changing story. And a little light reading. ... -shooting/

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Re: NRA News Conference

Postby kellory » Thu Dec 20, 2012 6:43 pm

Naw, not the government angle. However, there was a second guy in cuffs who ends up in the front of a cruiser. Why haven't we heard a peep about him? The news stories keep changing. I have read a few, then gone back to them, and they have been re-written, with the facts about the guns changed.
i know it is normal to withhold details during an investigation, but these are outright lies. the number and types of guns keep changing, and where they were found. And yet the coroner now says all were shot with the AR-15? Two pistols? four pistols? with or without the AR-15? Video appears to support it being found in the trunk of the car. First reports placed it there, then the story is rewritten, and it is now a shotgun in the car, and the AR-15 with the body. I read both accounts from the same News source.There was no correction given, nothing at all. Just the facts changed. Witnesses saw shadows from two attackers. (multiple light sources?) Maybe. Yet who was the guy chased, and pulled from the woods?
If the guns were not secured, would we not have already heard the screams about gun safety? We hear that loudly every time there is a kid with a gun, but there has been no mention of a weapons locker or safe, or IT'S LACK! Complete silence. That is usually the first thing we hear.
I do believe we are being lied to, too many "FACTS" keep changing. By who, and why is still a mystery. But have you ever heard the quote "Never let a tragedy go to waste."? Something is fishy here.
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Re: NRA News Conference

Postby kellory » Thu Dec 20, 2012 7:05 pm

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Associated Press/Angela K. Brown - This Monday, Dec. 17, 2012 photo shows the sign in front of the Harrold Independent School District in Harrold, Texas. The K-12 school has a policy allowing teachers and other …more

HARROLD, Texas (AP) — In this tiny Texas town, children and their parents don't give much thought to safety at the community's lone school — mostly because some of the teachers are carrying concealed weapons.
In remote Harrold, the nearest sheriff's office is 30 minutes away, and people tend to know — and trust — one another. So the school board voted to let teachers bring guns to school.
"We don't have money for a security guard, but this is a better solution," Superintendent David Thweatt said. "A shooter could take out a guard or officer with a visible, holstered weapon, but our teachers have master's degrees, are older and have had extensive training. And their guns are hidden. We can protect our children."
In the awful aftermath of last week's Connecticut elementary school shooting, lawmakers in a growing number of states — including Oklahoma, Missouri, Minnesota, South Dakota and Oregon — have said they will consider laws allowing teachers andschool administrators to carry firearms at school.
Texas law bans guns in schools unless the school has given written authorization. Arizona and six other states have similar laws with exceptions for people who have licenses to carry concealed weapons.
Harrold's school board voted unanimously in 2007 to allow employees to carry weapons. After obtaining a state concealed-weapons permit, each employee who wants to carry a weapon must be approved by the board based on his or her personality and reaction to a crisis, Thweatt said.
Employees also must undergo training in crisis intervention and hostage situations. And they must use bullets that minimize the risk of ricochet, similar to those carried by air marshals on planes.
CaRae Reinisch, who lives in the nearby community of Elliott, said she took her children out of a larger school and enrolled them in Harrold two years ago, partly because she felt they would be safer in a building with armed teachers.
"I think it's a great idea for trained teachers to carry weapons," Reinish said. "But I hate that it has come to this."
The superintendent won't disclose how many of the school's 50 employees carry weapons, saying that revealing that number might jeopardize school security.
The school, about 150 miles northwest of Fort Worth near the Oklahoma border, has 103 students from kindergarten through 12th grade. Most of them rarely think about who is carrying a gun.
"This is the first time in a long time that I've thought about it," said Matt Templeton, the principal's 17-year-old son. "And that's because of what happened" in Connecticut.
Thweatt said other Texas schools allow teachers to carry weapons, but he would not reveal their locations, saying they are afraid of negative publicity.
The Texas Education Agency said it had not heard of any other schools with such a policy. And the Brady Center to Prevent Gun Violence did not know of any other districts nationwide that allow school employees to carry concealed handguns.
But that may change soon.
Oklahoma state Rep. Mark McCullough said he is working on a bill that would allow teachers and administrators to receive firearms training through the Council on Law Enforcement Education and Training, which would authorize them to carry weapons at school and at school events. Other states are proposing or considering similar measures.
However, Michigan Gov. Rick Snyder this week vetoed legislation that would have allowed concealed weapons in schools, churches and day care centers, saying he seeks a more "thoughtful review" that includes school emergency policies and mental health-related issues.
In Texas, guns have an honored place in the state's culture, and politicians often describe owning a gun as essential to being Texan. At the state Capitol, concealed handgun license holders are allowed to skip the metal detectors that scan visitors.
Gov. Rick Perry has indicated he would prefer to give gun owners the widest possible latitude. Just days after the Connecticut attack, Perry said permit holders should be able to carry concealed weapons in any public place.
Last year, many Texas lawmakers supported a plan to give college students and professors with concealed handgun licenses the right to carry guns on campus, but the measure failed.
Opponents insist that having more people armed at a school, especially teachers or administrators who aren't trained to deal with crime on a daily basis, could lead to more injuries and deaths. They point to an August shooting outside the Empire State Building, where police killed a laid-off clothing designer after he fatally shot his former colleague. Nine bystanders were wounded by police gunfire, ricochets and fragments.
"You are going to put teachers, people teaching 6-year-olds in a school, and expect them to respond to an active-shooter situation?" said Ladd Everitt, a spokesman for the Washington, D.C.-based Coalition to Stop Gun Violence, who called the idea of arming teachers "madness."
Kristin Rowe-Finkbeiner said she would not have felt better if teachers at her children's Seattle school had been armed during a May shooting at a nearby cafe. A gunman killed four people at the cafe and another woman during a carjacking before killing himself. The school went on lockdown as a precaution.
"It would be highly concerning to me to know that guns were around my kids each and every day. ... Increasing our arms is not the answer," said Rowe-Finkbeiner, co-founder and CEO of
Dan Gross, president of the Brady Campaign, said focusing on arming teachers distracts from the "real things" that could help prevent a school shooting "and at worse it furthers a dangerous conversation that only talks about guns as protection without a discussion about the serious risks they present."
As the debate continues, Harrold's school plans to leave its policy unchanged.
"Nothing is 100 percent at all. ... But hope makes for a terrible plan, hoping that (a tragedy) won't happen," Thweatt said. "My question is: What have you done about it? How have you planned?"
Associated Press writers Juan A. Lozano in Houston and Nomaan Merchant in Dallas contributed to this report.
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Re: NRA News Conference

Postby Woods Walker » Thu Dec 20, 2012 8:26 pm

Not to belabor a point here...well OK, I AM going to belabor a point...but it goes to the number of rounds that a clip can hold issue. Let me say first off that I am NOT picking on JPH here. He did focus on this point but it's a good one to address because a lot of people are having the same feelings about it that he brought up, so here goes....

If you think that we should restrict ourselves to 5 shot clips and not 10's because fewer people would potentially be hurt when the next nutcase heads for an undefended concentration of children or other folks, then why the number of 5 for the clip capacity? Going by that logic, 5 or less people being shot is acceptable, but anything over 5 is not? (Now I'm NOT suggesting that ANYONE here is even remotely accepting of ANY shooting casulaties. I know they're NOT. It's the LOGIC of the argument I'm addressing!!!)

Think about it......If you want to reduce the clip capacity to 5, which I assume is a "compromise" number, then isn't the OTHER side of the issue...the potential number of people shot...also a "compromise"?

If the answer is NO people potentially shot, then why have ANY clip capacity? I mean, if the goal is to protect people and the only reason why they're being shot at all is because of the number of rounds that the weapon can hold, then why allow ANY weapon that can hold more than one? Or maybe NO weapons at all? That's what the gist of this "5 shot clip is OK, but more is not" is.
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Re: NRA News Conference

Postby kellory » Thu Dec 20, 2012 10:15 pm

This speaks for itself.

Guess our national leaders didn't expect this. On Thursday, Darrell Scott, the father of Rachel Scott, a victim of the Columbine High School shootings in Littleton, Colorado, was invited to address the House Judiciary Committee's subcommittee. What he said to our national leaders during this special session of Congress was painfully truthful.

They were not prepared for what he was to say, nor was it received well. It needs to be heard by every parent, every teacher, every politician, every sociologist, every psychologist, and every so-called expert! These courageous words spoken by Darrell Scott are powerful, penetrating, and deeply personal. There is no doubt that God sent this man as a voice crying in the wilderness.. The following is a portion of the transcript:
"Since the dawn of creation there has been both good & evil in the hearts of men and women. We all contain the seeds of kindness or the seeds of violence. The death of my wonderful daughter, Rachel Joy Scott, and the deaths of that heroic teacher, and the other eleven children who died must not be in vain. Their blood cries out for answers.

"The first recorded act of violence was when Cain slew his brother Abel out in the field. The villain was not the club he used.. Neither was it the NCA, the National Club Association. The true killer was Cain, and the reason for the murder could only be found in Cain's heart.

"In the days that followed the Columbine tragedy, I was amazed at how quickly fingers began to be pointed at groups such as the NRA. I am not a member of the NRA. I am not a hunter. I do not even own a gun. I am not here to represent or defend the NRA - because I don't believe that they are responsible for my daughter's death.

Therefore I do not believe that they need to be defended. If I believed they had anything to do with Rachel's murder I would be their strongest opponent.

I am here today to declare that Columbine was not just a tragedy -- it was a spiritual event that should be forcing us to look at where the real blame lies! Much of the blame lies here in this room. Much of the blame lies behind the pointing fingers of the accusers themselves. I wrote a poem just four nights ago that expresses my feelings best.

Your laws ignore our deepest needs,
Your words are empty air.
You've stripped away our heritage,
You've outlawed simple prayer.
Now gunshots fill our classrooms,
And precious children die.
You seek for answers everywhere,
And ask the question "Why?"
You regulate restrictive laws,
Through legislative creed.
And yet you fail to understand,
That God is what we need!

"Men and women are three-part beings. We all consist of body, mind, and spirit. When we refuse to acknowledge a third part of our make-up, we create a void that allows evil, prejudice, and hatred to rush in and wreak havoc. Spiritual presences were present within our educational systems for most of our nation's history. Many of our major colleges began as theological seminaries. This is a historical fact. What has happened to us as a nation? We have refused to honor God, and in so doing, we open the doors to hatred and violence. And when something as terrible as Columbine's tragedy occurs -- politicians immediately look for a scapegoat such as the NRA. They immediately seek to pass more restrictive laws that contribute to erode away our personal and private liberties. We do not need more restrictive laws. Eric and Dylan would not have been stopped by metal detectors. No amount of gun laws can stop someone who spends months planning this type of massacre. The real villain lies within our own hearts.

"As my son Craig lay under that table in the school library and saw his two friends murdered before his very eyes, he did not hesitate to pray in school. I defy any law or politician to deny him that right! I challenge every young person in America , and around the world, to realize that on April 20, 1999, at Columbine High School prayer was brought back to our schools. Do not let the many prayers offered by those students be in vain. Dare to move into the new millennium with a sacred disregard for legislation that violates your God-given right to communicate with Him. To those of you who would point your finger at the NRA -- I give to you a sincere challenge.. Dare to examine your own heart before casting the first stone!

My daughter's death will not be in vain! The young people of this country will not allow that to happen!"

- Darrell Scott
Do what the media did not - - let the nation hear this man's speech. Please send this out to everyone you can.
God Bless"
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Re: NRA News Conference

Postby shaman » Fri Dec 21, 2012 5:34 am

See, what I don't like about all this talk of gun control is that the Federal Government is the last entity on Earth I would trust to figure out how to control gun ownership. I've seen what they've done to the Postal Service and the tax code. Furthermore, I do not see where controlling high-cap mags or black rifles or pistol grips has anything to do with protecting children. Armed mothers and fathers protect children. If need be, teachers too.

JPH: Sorry guy, but I have to disagree with you. About 2 years into my life as a shooter, I saw a list of what guns they were thinking about banning. I'd just bought a nice used Remington 1100 shotgun for general purposes. THAT gun was on the list. I immediately went out and joined the NRA, and became a life member. The membership cost me as much as the dang shotgun, but I figured it was a good investment both ways. Today, that 1100 still sits leaning against the wall next to my bed and I still believe that the government cannot disarm its free citizens without become a tyranny.

Gotta run for now.
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