Reactions to King Buck Story

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Re: Reactions to King Buck Story

Postby GrandView » Fri May 13, 2011 5:03 pm

Any mass and point length measurement would be secondary to determining if the point was normal or its origin from the main beam.

If only because.......if determined to be a normal point, there would be a mass measurement on either side. If determined to be an abnormal point, there would only be one mass measurement........presumably between the abnormal point and the next point in this the point preceding the abnormal point would be G2 and the point following the abnormal point would be G3. As shown in the example picture from the Fair Chase article.

I certainly defer to any experienced measurer that wishes to weigh in.........


old buckeroo
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Re: Reactions to King Buck Story

Postby old buckeroo » Fri May 13, 2011 6:10 pm

Who is this Reneau guy anyway?????? Is he a priest???? He seems to dictate a lot of stuff!!!! Perhaps he's wearing something too tight????? Pretty big ego in my eyes!!!

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Re: Reactions to King Buck Story

Postby finnwolf308 » Sat May 14, 2011 6:53 am

B & C have not followed their own procedures in scoring the King antlers. To allow one man, Reaneu, the dictate for B & C reduces not only his crediblity but B & C's crediblity. The simplist solution for everyone is the group-score; but again one man prevented this from happening, not once, but twice. What is Reaneu hiding or covering up? A real man would allow his dictatorial decision to be reviewed by his peers; namely B & C group-scoring. :(

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Re: Reactions to King Buck Story

Postby bowfisher1 » Sat May 14, 2011 10:01 am

This whole ordeal looks very bad, just one more thing for non-hunters to get on us about. Its a big deer just be happy with that and if they say its not a world record deal with it.

Whitetail Warrior
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Re: Reactions to King Buck Story

Postby Whitetail Warrior » Sat May 14, 2011 9:12 pm

First off this is an awsome buck! No matter the score, it is a world class animal and is at least deserving of being seen. As far as the issue about the right G-3 goes, I will say that when I saw pictures of the deer in D&DH my first instinct was that the point was in fact abnormal. My first impression, before ever reading the story, was that it shared a common base with the G-2. My interest was peaked after reading the story though, and I sought out additonal pics of it. I can say, that I can see where others disagree that it is abnormal and is a typical point. It is very, very close and could honestly go either way. I may not be an expert, but I would consider myself a deer enthusiast to say the very least. I have seen many, many world class racks in person and in the magazines and I think I undestand the scoring system pretty well. Again based on my initial instinct I thought the point was abnormal. However, I will concede that I have not seen this deer in person and the pictures I have seen may not do the deer justice. My opinion could change if I ever had the chance to see it in person.

As far as the article goes, I think it was well written (as most D&DH articles are), but it was a little one sided. I got the impression the author believed this deer to be a typical 6x6 and was playing up the conspiracy story. As I read it, I really thought there were a few inconsistancies in it. I do, in fact, think that proper B&C protocal was followed considering the rack was broken. I really don't see a major conspiracy. The point is so close to the typical-- non-typical line that there is bound to be differing opinions on it. It just happens that the opinion that matters the most is that the point is non-typical. The article pointed to several "experts" that viewed it as typical, but really gave very little from the other view point. I am sure they could've found quite a few that believed it to be abnormal. Also remember, this rack was purchased for what was probably a pretty good sum of money. The new owner has a vested interest in the rack now. He would probably stand to gain alot from owning the B&C typical world record. So to say that there isn't at least a possibility that there is some score shopping going on would be a little misguided.

Again, this buck could be viewed either way. At this point I would say the point is sharing a common base, but I wouldn't say that I am so sure of it I would feel comfortable betting the family farm on it. This is a great, great whitetail and at least people are now getting to see it. This buck definetly deserves to be seen. I would also congradulate Mr. King on his accomplishment in harvesting such a fine animal. Harvesting a world class buck is something very, very few of us will ever get to experience and this deer is definetly world class. It is unfortunate that his score in B&C, had it not been withdrawn, would not give the proper indication of his true size. However, that is true of several deer in the record books because of current scoring guidelines. This deer is special and can stand on its on merits regardless of score.

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Re: Reactions to King Buck Story

Postby vipermann7 » Sun May 15, 2011 2:56 pm

I've never been a fan of deducting inches/points for "abnormal" points in any case. It's a records system and the people that run it set up the rules. According to the B&C website, they took steps with additional scorers to clear up any errors, and they feel they have come to an appropriate decision. I'm not an official scorer with knowledge of and experience with the scoring criteria, nor have I examined the rack personally, so I'm saying I agree or disagree with the decision. Rather, I'm just looking at the deer for what it is: a super awesome big buck that anyone would be proud to have.

As far as I'm concerned, the B&C record book is just a book filled with numbers. It doesn't detract from how awesome that deer is, or the memories it will have for the dude that shot it because of how "the book" says its measured. The inches of antler are there, no matter what you call it or how you measure it. It's too bad for the deer and the hunter that the deer wont be officially "recognized" in the record book like many believe it should be, but it's a gray area of judgement in record keeping system that in the end, doesn't really mean anything.

At least looking forward, it has set a precedent on how B&C will or should score similar racks in the future. Good buck, Mr. King. I hope the good memories will overshadow the disappointment you have gone through.

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Re: Reactions to King Buck Story

Postby danesdad » Sun May 15, 2011 4:52 pm

The article makes it look like Reneau wields too much power in this decision and many other scorers would have judged the point as typical. One would think that the rack would be scored by an independant panel just to avoid controversy. If the act of "shopping" the rack aropund to get a better score is a big issue, that makes it seem like the scoring system is arbitrary.
Hunting: 10% skill and 90% location.

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Re: Reactions to King Buck Story

Postby GrandView » Sun May 15, 2011 5:18 pm

danesdad wrote:The article makes it look like Reneau wields too much power in this decision and many other scorers would have judged the point as typical.

Would be interesting to have those other B&C scorers weigh in on the specific rule that Reneau used to declare the point abnormal.

Hardly anyone is debating the B&C response or the link they provided specific to the abnormality they ruled on the King buck.

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Re: Reactions to King Buck Story

Postby Jay » Sun May 15, 2011 8:45 pm

I gave yoiu the answer, youi refuse to see it. the tine comes off the top of the beem, has a mate on the other beem, Has a ridge going into the main beem on both sides in and out has the figure eight. Take the blinders off. Its in front of you but you refuse to look.

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Re: Reactions to King Buck Story

Postby DFREEMAN » Mon May 16, 2011 8:17 am

I believe truly there is more to this magnificent Bucks story than is being brought up. Go back to the original story and reason for his hesitating to score it. Let's just say if you drop a "Ming vase" what happens to it's credible value? Posting heated reactions are non productive and only fuel the fire of rack fever. Bravo for a beautiful trophy, record or not.
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