How do I

What's the hunt looking like this year in your area? Share!
Smoothbore
 
Posts: 73
Joined: Thu Oct 09, 2008 9:29 am

RE: How do I

Postby Smoothbore » Fri Oct 10, 2008 4:43 am

Listen, I'm not saying that's how you'd approach it just giving a heads up of what not to do. Also depending on how many acres you have you might not have to worry to much about what your nieghbors do. If I were you I would set up some "sanctuaries" (ideal bedding areas) and leave them completely alone. Buck and does alike will gravitate to these areas and if there are really food sources like you describe the deer will seldom leave the property. Set upa stand between Buck and doe bedding areas and let the fun begin.

User avatar
howhill1
 
Posts: 669
Joined: Fri Apr 25, 2008 12:50 pm

RE: How do I

Postby howhill1 » Fri Oct 10, 2008 2:54 pm

ORIGINAL: Woods Walker

I have another take on this. For me, QDM is a matter of herd BALANCE; in that the NUMBER of deer must first be what the habitat can sustain, and then the ratio of bucks to does must be balanced within that habitat.
 
Bigger and older bucks should be a BY PRODUCT of that balance, and not a means to an end itself.
 
When I first started deer hunting in Illinois 30 years ago, we passed NOTHING up. If it was brown, it was down. Bucks, does, fawns...it didn't matter. We were DEER hunting. That's how Illinois had always run it's modern deer seasons (the first modern deer season in Illinois was in 1962, I think).
 
Well guess what? From my FIRST deer season here, I pretty much had close to a 50/50 chance that if I saw a deer to shoot, it would be a buck as a doe. And you know what else? There were not anywhere NEAR the numbers of deer that we have now, but in spite of that, I saw more RACK BUCKS in my first season or so of Illinois deer hunting, than I did in the 3 years I deer hunted in New Jersey where I grew up! Jersey wouldn't let you shoot does then, and a buck had to have at least 3" antlers to be legal (I always wondered how you got a deer to stand still long enough so that you could measure him...)
 
"BALANCE"...........
 
Fast forward to today, where many times QDM is merely a cover word for TDM, or "Don't Shoot That Buck So I Can Shoot Him Later When He's A...(insert ego number of choice here).
 
To me, what makes a buck (or doe), a "trophy" is the AGE it has been able to achieve, BY SURVIVING SEVERAL HUNTING SEASONS. To earn that, they must have been HUNTED!
 
A buck that lives to 3.5 years or more becausehe's had a protected status is to me, NOT a "trophy" by my definition of the word, but merely a life support device for a set of calcium deposits. Put another way, he hasn't EARNED it.
 
If a big rack is what you are hunting for, then just go to a pay to shoot place and pay for the biggest one your wallet and ego can afford. You can't have it both ways, and as what many QDM'ers are now learning, you can't stockpile mature bucks either.
 
I would take more pride in an 8 or 10 pointer that's been shot at for 2 or 3 years, and knows what it's like to be hunted, than one that would score higher, but is a "newbie" to the reality of pursuit, and never had a shot fired at him until he wasalready
full grown. You might even speculate that such practices may eventually WEAKEN the gene pool, because the smartest and heartiest bucks are NOT the ones passing on the genes.

 
 
agree 99% the one thing i offer for discussions sake is that a deer has the same genes or genetic traits, even though they may not be readily apparent, when hes a fawn that he has as a six year old ten pointer.  
"please join the N.R.A. as well as your state rifle association! these are critical times for ALL gun owners. Be informed, be active and stay vigilant"

User avatar
JPH
 
Posts: 3416
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2008 10:28 am

RE: How do I

Postby JPH » Fri Oct 10, 2008 3:30 pm

ORIGINAL: Woods Walker

I have another take on this. For me, QDM is a matter of herd BALANCE; in that the NUMBER of deer must first be what the habitat can sustain, and then the ratio of bucks to does must be balanced within that habitat.
 
Bigger and older bucks should be a BY PRODUCT of that balance, and not a means to an end itself.
 
When I first started deer hunting in Illinois 30 years ago, we passed NOTHING up. If it was brown, it was down. Bucks, does, fawns...it didn't matter. We were DEER hunting. That's how Illinois had always run it's modern deer seasons (the first modern deer season in Illinois was in 1962, I think).
 
Well guess what? From my FIRST deer season here, I pretty much had close to a 50/50 chance that if I saw a deer to shoot, it would be a buck as a doe. And you know what else? There were not anywhere NEAR the numbers of deer that we have now, but in spite of that, I saw more RACK BUCKS in my first season or so of Illinois deer hunting, than I did in the 3 years I deer hunted in New Jersey where I grew up! Jersey wouldn't let you shoot does then, and a buck had to have at least 3" antlers to be legal (I always wondered how you got a deer to stand still long enough so that you could measure him...)
 
"BALANCE"...........
 
Fast forward to today, where many times QDM is merely a cover word for TDM, or "Don't Shoot That Buck So I Can Shoot Him Later When He's A...(insert ego number of choice here).
 
To me, what makes a buck (or doe), a "trophy" is the AGE it has been able to achieve, BY SURVIVING SEVERAL HUNTING SEASONS. To earn that, they must have been HUNTED!
 
A buck that lives to 3.5 years or more becausehe's had a protected status is to me, NOT a "trophy" by my definition of the word, but merely a life support device for a set of calcium deposits. Put another way, he hasn't EARNED it.
 
If a big rack is what you are hunting for, then just go to a pay to shoot place and pay for the biggest one your wallet and ego can afford. You can't have it both ways, and as what many QDM'ers are now learning, you can't stockpile mature bucks either.
 
I would take more pride in an 8 or 10 pointer that's been shot at for 2 or 3 years, and knows what it's like to be hunted, than one that would score higher, but is a "newbie" to the reality of pursuit, and never had a shot fired at him until he wasalready
full grown. You might even speculate that such practices may eventually WEAKEN the gene pool, because the smartest and heartiest bucks are NOT the ones passing on the genes.

 
I agree with some, but not all of Woods Walker's post.
 
Agreement:
-The lines are often blurred between QDM and TDM.
-Balance is the key to QDM.
-Age is a byproduct of balance.
-Big antlers are a by product age.
 
Disagreement:
-Protecting young deer does NOT weaken the gene pool!
-Just because a deer has not been shot at, does NOT mean he is easy to kill.
 
We should remember that a deer is hunted every day of his life. They do not know that those hunters driving deer are only hunting for does. They know danger, they react, and they get better with age.
 
No one has ever tried to kill me (at least not seriously) but I bet I'm harder to kill than when I was 17.

hunter480
 
Posts: 696
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2008 9:44 am

RE: How do I

Postby hunter480 » Fri Oct 10, 2008 3:46 pm

I`ll dig out my tired old refrain, and say that every deer, regardless of age is a trophy. And qdm might be able to convert me over, if they changed their name, since all deer are already "quality" and don`t need an org to make them so.
 
Soapbox put away now.

User avatar
JOEL
 
Posts: 1099
Joined: Tue May 06, 2008 7:05 am

RE: How do I

Postby JOEL » Fri Oct 10, 2008 9:59 pm

ORIGINAL: hunter480

I`ll dig out my tired old refrain, and say that every deer, regardless of age is a trophy. And qdm might be able to convert me over, if they changed their name, since all deer are already "quality" and don`t need an org to make them so.

Soapbox put away now.
Amen,any deer that you can get within (bow,crossbow,shotgun,rifle,pointy stick,heavy rock,club) is a trophy.fooling a hormone crazed buck thats stupid enough to walk through a field miday big deal,shoot a mature doe or one of the 2,3 yearlings with her .well then your a true hunter !As for you and your neighbors.I know i sure dont want anyone telling me how much butter to put on my roll..you hunt your way they will  hunt there way.ya both can "MANAGE "   THAT BUCK BUT COME THE RUT HE'LL WALK ACROSS COUNTY ROAD 10 AND GET HIT BY A TRUCK,.
"Go afield with a good attitude, with respect for the wildlife you hunt and for the forest and fields in which you walk. Immerse yourself in the outdoor experience. It will cleanse your soul and make you a better person." - Fred Bear

User avatar
JPH
 
Posts: 3416
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2008 10:28 am

RE: How do I

Postby JPH » Sat Oct 11, 2008 6:04 am

ORIGINAL: hunter480

...qdm might be able to convert me over, if they changed their name, since all deer are already "quality" and don`t need an org to make them so.


 
The term "Quality" is intended to modify the term "Management", not the "Deer".
 
If you refuse to embrace a style of conservation because you don't like the name, well that's a little like opposing the possession of certain firearms because they are "assult weapons".
 
We could call it "Doe Control, Habitat Improvement, Education, Herd Monitoring, and Hunter Restraint, Mangament" or D.C.H.I.E.H.M.H.R.M. but that would be hard to fit on a ball cap. 

User avatar
Goose
 
Posts: 2804
Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2008 6:36 pm

RE: How do I

Postby Goose » Sat Oct 11, 2008 9:56 am

I would suggest harvesting what you want to harvest, pass on what you want to pass on, work torwards your interests and let the end results do the talking for you. I would under no circumstances tell people what to shoot, you have no idea why they are shooting what they are. If they are happy with what they are getting then you should be as well. Its their land and their choices. After a while theyll see what your doing and how its working for you and if thats the road they want to travel thayll take it, if not theyll do what makes them happy and you aint gonna change it. Good luck on your goals, Like Dan Schmidt said in his book "those that pass up smaller bucks and shoot does while waiting for that trophy are a notch above the others" it takes alot of restraint and I wish you luck with it.
Jake

Genesis 27:3 Take your bow and quiver full of arrows out into the open country, and hunt some wild game.....

hunter480
 
Posts: 696
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2008 9:44 am

RE: How do I

Postby hunter480 » Sat Oct 11, 2008 11:29 am

ORIGINAL: JPH

ORIGINAL: hunter480

...qdm might be able to convert me over, if they changed their name, since all deer are already "quality" and don`t need an org to make them so.



The term "Quality" is intended to modify the term "Management", not the "Deer".

If you refuse to embrace a style of conservation because you don't like the name, well that's a little like opposing the possession of certain firearms because they are "assult weapons".

We could call it "Doe Control, Habitat Improvement, Education, Herd Monitoring, and Hunter Restraint, Mangament" or D.C.H.I.E.H.M.H.R.M. but that would be hard to fit on a ball cap. 

 
[:D]

User avatar
EatDeer
 
Posts: 740
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2008 9:02 pm

RE: How do I

Postby EatDeer » Sun Oct 12, 2008 7:49 am

ORIGINAL: JPH

ORIGINAL: hunter480

...qdm might be able to convert me over, if they changed their name, since all deer are already "quality" and don`t need an org to make them so.



The term "Quality" is intended to modify the term "Management", not the "Deer".

If you refuse to embrace a style of conservation because you don't like the name, well that's a little like opposing the possession of certain firearms because they are "assult weapons".

We could call it "Doe Control, Habitat Improvement, Education, Herd Monitoring, and Hunter Restraint, Mangament" or D.C.H.I.E.H.M.H.R.M. but that would be hard to fit on a ball cap. 
Can I call it "doe killings"..and can we get that printed on a ballcap?![:D]
"Let a young buck go, so he can grow."

User avatar
JPH
 
Posts: 3416
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2008 10:28 am

RE: How do I

Postby JPH » Sun Oct 12, 2008 8:34 am

ORIGINAL: EatDeer

ORIGINAL: JPH

ORIGINAL: hunter480

...qdm might be able to convert me over, if they changed their name, since all deer are already "quality" and don`t need an org to make them so.



The term "Quality" is intended to modify the term "Management", not the "Deer".

If you refuse to embrace a style of conservation because you don't like the name, well that's a little like opposing the possession of certain firearms because they are "assult weapons".

We could call it "Doe Control, Habitat Improvement, Education, Herd Monitoring, and Hunter Restraint, Mangament" or D.C.H.I.E.H.M.H.R.M. but that would be hard to fit on a ball cap. 
Can I call it "doe killings"..and can we get that printed on a ballcap?![:D]

 
Yeah I suppose, but I'm sticking with DCHIEHMHRM.

PreviousNext

Return to General Discussions

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 9 guests