Cheap Mgt. (long post, sorry)

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northernVT
 
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RE: Cheap Mgt. (long post, sorry)

Postby northernVT » Fri Oct 24, 2008 3:55 pm

Keep in mind that when you cut, it is not an instant fix. It will take a couple of years for browse and cover to grow back. This should create a travel corridor for the deer. Figure out were you want your stands according to wind and travel, and cut accordingly. Corn is a great late season food for deer. It is high in fat and carbohydrates. Deer need those for the winter months. Do you research as far as year-round forage for deer. Spring through spring. Just remember that this is a marathon, not a sprint and you will do great.
 
Good luck

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JPH
 
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RE: Cheap Mgt. (long post, sorry)

Postby JPH » Sat Oct 25, 2008 11:11 am

ORIGINAL: northernVT

Keep in mind that when you cut, it is not an instant fix. It will take a couple of years for browse and cover to grow back. This should create a travel corridor for the deer. Figure out were you want your stands according to wind and travel, and cut accordingly. Corn is a great late season food for deer. It is high in fat and carbohydrates. Deer need those for the winter months. Do you research as far as year-round forage for deer. Spring through spring. Just remember that this is a marathon, not a sprint and you will do great.

Good luck


You know, I am going to respectfully disagree. I have found timber thinning to be darn near an "instant fix". If you leave tops on the ground or hinge cut, you put food in front of the deer faster than planting a food plot. And the brush piles begin to enhance things as soon as the deer get used to them. 

Not that I would suggest cutting during the season, but it can work fast. I know I live in fertile area, but I have seen lush regrowth coming up in an area that I have thinned within the first summer.

But please note, I am talking about cutting on a small scale. I like to do little areas and move the work around the property from year to year, so that there is always something in one stage or another.

Demoderby4
 
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RE: Cheap Mgt. (long post, sorry)

Postby Demoderby4 » Sat Oct 25, 2008 3:37 pm

Yeah i wasnt going to do any cutting during the season, im going to start this project in January when the season is over, just trying to do some homework and be prepared when the time comes. I understand how the cutting of timber can be a quick fix, hopefully thats the case here, but i can see how it would take time to work as well. I already have an idea of what i want to do in some area's but i still have a lot f land to get used to. Thanks for all the help guys i really appreciate it!!

Demoderby4
 
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RE: Cheap Mgt. (long post, sorry)

Postby Demoderby4 » Mon Oct 27, 2008 8:27 am

What about deer harvest? What should i be doing to make a healthy herd? I'm pretty sure i have about a 10 doe to 1 buck ratio or so on the land :/ i know i want to try to get at least 10 doe off the land by the end of the year (i know thats not much, but its a start) which shouldn't be a problem come gun season when more people come to hunt on the land. Just thought i would throw that out there for you guys.

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ranwin33
 
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RE: Cheap Mgt. (long post, sorry)

Postby ranwin33 » Mon Oct 27, 2008 8:41 am

Contact your local NRCS office to see if there are any cost share programs available.  Also many have private land consultants that are happy to come out and do a "walk thru" on your land and provide advice at no charge.

If you have old fields, spray and burn.  Again the state may be willing to help with the cost.  Then let the weeds/forbs return.

A chainsaw can be your best friend if you have wood lots of sufficient size.  But if you just have a patch of woods here and there, it might be best to leave them alone.

As for a 10-1 doe to buck ratio - probably not.  It's nearly mathematically impossible to get beyond 3-1.  That being said, shoot the does, eliminating deer where the denisities are high will only improve your habitat and allow the ones remaining to do better.
“There are two spiritual dangers in not owning a farm. One is the danger of supposing that breakfast comes from the grocery, and the other that heat comes from the furnace.”
Aldo Leopold

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JPH
 
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RE: Cheap Mgt. (long post, sorry)

Postby JPH » Mon Oct 27, 2008 8:51 am

While your sightings may be 10:1, I doubt the herd is. My reading on the subject has lead me to believe that in a free ranging, anything over 3-4:1 is almost impossible even if you were to try. Remember, 50% of the fawns you see are bucks, and bucks of 3.5+ are often seemingly invisable.
 
That is not to deny the importance of an aggressive doe harvest. If you are seeing antlerless deer at a rate of 10:1 on 400 acres, you may want to take as many does as possible for the next season or two. Be warned, it is not as easy as it looks.
 
Another thing that can be helpful is to learn how to identify bucks by age. protecting all yearlings is a good start. If you feel okay about that, you can move up to protecting 2.5's and even 3.5's, depending on your situation.
 
I envy you. I wish I had that kind of acerage to play with. Good luck!

Demoderby4
 
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RE: Cheap Mgt. (long post, sorry)

Postby Demoderby4 » Mon Oct 27, 2008 9:32 am

Yeah it def. is a lot harder than it looks! lol! i thought by now i would have at least 2-3 does but i haven't had any luck at all this year! I should of had two so far, but a missed shot (thanks to a branch) and then earlier in the year right as i was about to let the arrow fly she spooked seemingly out of nowhere. I saw one buck but it was pre season scouting (figures lol) an have seen 5 more doe's since then (out of range) I have no problem letting yearlings walk that will be no problem, i really just want to focus on getting doe's out of there this year and next, if i get a chance at a good buck, sure i'll take it but im trying to focus on the doe'e right now. Hopefully i can learn how to do the aging, i'm decent at on the spot guessing but i would like to learn more about it.

northernVT
 
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RE: Cheap Mgt. (long post, sorry)

Postby northernVT » Mon Oct 27, 2008 11:54 am

Thanks JPH. You are right. I guess when I started talking about cutting, I take for advantage that I usually clear cut areas and let them grow back for 10 years, rotating my cutting area. When you hinge cut pole timber and leave mature tops on the ground, deer take to it instantly. In my area, clear cutting usually takes at least one year for new growth to get anywhere near enough in growth for cover and food.
Keep shotting demoderby. You will hit one sooner than later.

Demoderby4
 
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RE: Cheap Mgt. (long post, sorry)

Postby Demoderby4 » Mon Oct 27, 2008 2:35 pm

If i start cutting down in the late winter months (jan-feb) will the deer still want to be around the cut down stuff by the time hunting season comes around? Or will they try to find some other places to hang out? 

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JPH
 
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RE: Cheap Mgt. (long post, sorry)

Postby JPH » Mon Oct 27, 2008 2:42 pm

It will help next hunting season. The brush piles will still be there and the new growth that comes up will provide even more ground cover. But also seriously look into hinge-cutting. If done right, the tree will remain alive, but grow at ground level.

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