2008 & 2009 Photos - Is this the same buck????

[hunt4ever]

ORIGINAL: hunt4ever

ORIGINAL: Headrush

I've killed 2 bucks like that with my bow. Inside their ears, "basket racks" we call them around here. Nice deer but IMO not more than 2 yrs old tops. If you look at his face he's not fully mature yet. His shoulders and chest arent filled out. Give him 2-3 more years and he'll be 190+ lbs field dressed and sporting a far better head set. I don't think they're the same deer either, but I wonder if they might have the same Dad just a year apart.

Looking at WayneL's 9 pinter compared to ths one, I think he shot a 3-4 yr old. compare their faces, and bodies in the photo's and you'll see what I mean. Not to stir things up...just my 2 cents.

Good luck this year everyone!

Bill

[font="times new roman"][size="3"]Bill, You may be right about being a 2 year old; however, if it is the same buck as last year, which most believe he is, he is at least a 3 YO.  In area I  hunt, Greenwich - Washington County,  IMHO there is no way he was a yearling last year.  Furthermore, if he was a 2 YO last year, he would be a very high end 2 YO, based on past harvests in the area.  He is a "keeper", so the only way we will find out his true age is get his jawbone which I hope to do.

Bill,
[/size][/font][font="times new roman"][size="3"]I like you thought that it might be different bucks, but have the same dad just a different year.  If they are different bucks, I would think that is a good possibility.
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[font="times new roman"][size="3"]The consensus from this forum and others is that it is the same buck.  However, his antler and mass/weight isn't what one would expect, if he was getting good nutrition. I have a couple of  2009 photos of this buck (I think he is the same buck) and embed the one taken in July and one in Nov.  Since I can only attach one photo, I will I will post the Nov. photo under separate post.  Both photos show a buck under nourished and thinner than what he should be.   I also have other photos of thin deer (does, fawns,  & bucks) which are very disturbing and leads me to believe that I have a nutrition problem.

Not to bore you too much, a little background on the property I hunt is as follows:[/size][/font][font="times new roman"][size="3"]
[/size][/font][font="times new roman"][size="3"]1)   The 300+ acre dairy farm I hunt has been in the family since the mid 1850's and is currently owned and operated by my two cousins.  [/size][/font] [font="times new roman"][size="3"] 2)   Five (5) years it was decided to sell all the dairy cows and concentrate on their Maple Syrup business. As most know, there is very little money for the normal farmer in selling milk.  They have been in the syrup business on a part time basis for over 25 years and now typically produces over 2500 gallons of maple syrup annually and are one of the largest producers of maple syrup in NY State. [/size][/font] [font="times new roman"][size="3"] 3)   Since it is no longer a dairy farm, the 100+ acres of corn, alflier, hay, etc. no longer exist.  What were cultivated fields is now fields just being cut to prevent them growing into useless brush.  Except for a few small food plots that I had planted, these fields now have grass in them with very little quality forage for whitetails.  This is a real retention problem plus herd health resulting in poor fawn retention, low weight, and poor antler growth.   What have I missed[/size][/font][font="times new roman"][size="3"]

To resolve this problem, I am considering planting next Spring a heavy dose of Eagle Brand Forage Soybeans and/or Cow Pies.  This will help the soil plus help doe and fawn development and buck antler growth.  Additionally, once the soybeans and Cow Peas have done their thing, I will replace them with Brassica, Rape, and Foriage and Purple Top Turnips, etc. [/size][/font][font="times new roman"][size="3"]Any other suggestions on what I should plant are more than welcomed [/size][/font] [font="times new roman"][size="3"]Sorry for going on so long, but wanted to present a good picture of the situation so others may weigh in on the problem and possible solution(s). 
Thanks for your patience and happy hunting,
[size="4"]Tom Mac[/size] [/size][/font][font="times new roman"][size="3"][/size][/font][font="times new roman"][size="3"][/size][/font][font="times new roman"][size="3"][/size][/font]
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Guys, Here is the 2nd embedded photo from previous post.
[font="times new roman"][size="4"]Tom Mac[/size][/font]

[Headrush]

Go to http://www.northcountrywhitetails.com/

Neil Dougherty was at our local bow shop last year and gave us a seminar on how to hold deer on your property. Since they need food, water , and cover and most places have water or cover...it's he who has the groceries who keeps the most deer. Anyway what I'm getting at here is that if you and others like me don't have expendable cash to throw down on seed, and the equipment to maintain these plots....Neil showed us ways to improve your habitat without planting. VERY INTERESTING! The first thing I thought of while reading that long reply was maybe an increase in general nutrition or at least tonnage per acre would help you and the herd a bunch!

Neil and his team have a few videos on property improvement through selective clearcutting, "Releasing" local fruit bearing/mast bearing trees on your property etc. In fact releasing the fruit trees is the FIRST thing he said he likes to do on a new property. I asked him about crabapples too and he said even those will help hold those deer on your property. He also said to leave at LEAST 30% of your property undisturbed as a sanctuary. HE clearly said No scouting, shed hunting or disturbance of any kind. So If you have plenty of food, water, and the safest corner of the woods around, you're 3 BIG steps closer to those larger deer

With 300 cres you're luckier than the majority of guys I know, so I bet you could really get a good thing rolling over there. Hope I helped. Good luck!

[hunt4ever]

ORIGINAL: Headrush

Go to http://www.northcountrywhitetails.com/

Neil Dougherty was at our local bow shop last year and gave us a seminar on how to hold deer on your property. Since they need food, water , and cover and most places have water or cover...it's he who has the groceries who keeps the most deer. Anyway what I'm getting at here is that if you and others like me don't have expendable cash to throw down on seed, and the equipment to maintain these plots....Neil showed us ways to improve your habitat without planting. VERY INTERESTING! The first thing I thought of while reading that long reply was maybe an increase in general nutrition or at least tonnage per acre would help you and the herd a bunch!

Neil and his team have a few videos on property improvement through selective clearcutting, "Releasing" local fruit bearing/mast bearing trees on your property etc. In fact releasing the fruit trees is the FIRST thing he said he likes to do on a new property. I asked him about crabapples too and he said even those will help hold those deer on your property. He also said to leave at LEAST 30% of your property undisturbed as a sanctuary. HE clearly said No scouting, shed hunting or disturbance of any kind. So If you have plenty of food, water, and the safest corner of the woods around, you're 3 BIG steps closer to those larger deer

With 300 cres you're luckier than the majority of guys I know, so I bet you could really get a good thing rolling over there. Hope I helped. Good luck!

Headrush, Thanks for your comments, I appreciate it.  I know Neil quite well and had him do a survey @ the farm 3 years ago.  Neil's report of his survey indicated that the natural habitat and the layout (pastures, fields and woods) @ the farm was "one of the best he has ever seen".  I have also met Neil at several QDMA presentation/courses.  One of the courses I attended was "The Whitetail Weekend" @ Kindred Spirits with Neil, Craig (his dad) & Charlie Alsheimer.  It was a very informative weekend and I really enjoyed it, it was worth every penny of it   For someone who can not get enough of whitetails, these guys are the best.  I think what I like best about these guys are that they look at whitetails from a North East perspective.  I don't know how much you are into QDMA, but I think that is rate on.  I have taken the Level I & II courses and hope to get QDMA certified early next year.  The courses are expensive, but are great and have lecturers that really know their S---.  I enjoy it all.  To solve my nutrition problem, it has been suggested that in the spring I need to have several acres of forage soybeans and/or cow peas to help the does and push buck antler growth.  After the soybeans have done their thing, I will plant turnips and brassica food plots to help the deer fatten up for the winter.   That is my take and happy hunting,  [font="times new roman"][size="4"]Tom Mac[/size][/font]