30-06 close range

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reeper0697
 
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30-06 close range

Postby reeper0697 » Sun Dec 20, 2009 5:34 pm

Is a heavier grain bullet or a lighter grain bullet better for close range? I have wondered this for a long time but it seems I can never find the right answer so I just figured I would ask my fellow D&DH members. I shoot Remington core lokt 165 grains out of a 30-06 but I always wondered if the 150 grains or the 180 grains are better for ranges under 50 yards. I don't plan on switching (unless some stores can finally get my shells back on the shelf) I'm just wondering if a heavier or lighter grain bullet is better for close range shots. Thanks!
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ranwin33
 
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RE: 30-06 close range

Postby ranwin33 » Sun Dec 20, 2009 5:55 pm

The weight of the bullet will matter far less than the ability of the bullet to expand, and then hold together.

If you're debating 150-165-180 grain bullet weights, they're probably all pretty much the same under 50 yards. The 150's may be a little faster, but at 50 yards wind isn't going to have any real effect, and flatter shooting isn't going to matter, and all three deliver more than enough energy for deer or just about anything else.

If you're going out to 300 yards or so, then you might choose the flatter, faster 150's. Check the ballistics though, again they all might be so similar as to not really matter.
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berudd
 
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RE: 30-06 close range

Postby berudd » Mon Dec 21, 2009 7:35 am

I've wondered the same thing. It may be one of those questions where there really is no right answer. At short distances all of those bullets are going to punch right through a deer regardless of what bones the bullet may hit. If I were going to put forth a theory based on little or know fact what so ever I might say the lighter faster bullet would be better for a given caliber. I'll base that the the higher velocity producing more of a shock effect when it hits the animal. Of course I can counter that by saying the heavier bullet may expand more and create a larger wound channel (not sure if that is true though). So, to answer your next question, no I really don't know what I am talking about. :) Just tossing out a few ideas.

I think we are really just talking degrees of dead here. We could probably expand the discussion out to larger, slower bullets for close range like th .45/70 and such as opposed to an high velocity modern round.

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reeper0697
 
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RE: 30-06 close range

Postby reeper0697 » Mon Dec 21, 2009 3:18 pm

Thanks alot for your replies Ranwin33 and Berudd. I have always wondered about this but really had no idea. At the rate this is going I may switch to the 150's since I can't find the 165's anywhere anymore. I don't really "need" more ammunition but I like to be stocked up on it. Most of my kills are under 50 yards so I figured I would throw the question out there.
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shaman
 
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RE: 30-06 close range

Postby shaman » Tue Dec 22, 2009 4:00 am

It's all sort of hair-splitting when you're talking deer with a 30-06 at under 50 yards. I used to shoot 180 grainers at deer, and they fell over dead. My closest shot was 10 yards.  I then switched to 165 grainers and they still fell over dead.  When my son finally started hunting on his own, I got him started with a 30-06 and 150 grainers.  The deer fell over dead. 

Generally the 150 grain loads have the least recoil, the 180 grainers have the most. The 180 grain bullet is the tougher of the three, given the same bullet manufacturer and product line, but all three will mushroom with the same effectiveness on a deer at 50 yards.  The 180 grainer will maintain the highest retained energy. The 150 grainer will maintain the highest velocity downrange.  Absolutely none of this makes any difference at 50 yards or even 100 yards.  Neither does spire point versus round nose or boat tail vs straight. 

The bottom line:  shoot what works best in your rifle.
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reeper0697
 
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RE: 30-06 close range

Postby reeper0697 » Tue Dec 22, 2009 4:10 am

Thanks alot for the information, Shaman. Thats some more info I was looking for. I really didn't know if it would make a big difference at that close a range or not. I am going to stick with the 165s even though they are a needle in a haystack to find here these days.
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berudd
 
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RE: 30-06 close range

Postby berudd » Thu Dec 24, 2009 12:30 pm

Yeah at 100 yards, and really a bit beyond that I would say, the 30.06 is wuite a bit in excess of what is really needed to kill a deer with any of the typical bullets designed for deer. That probably holds true for any of the medium bore and above rifle rounds.

danesdad
 
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RE: 30-06 close range

Postby danesdad » Thu Dec 24, 2009 7:10 pm

I'd bet at close ranges, all three will most often pass right through.
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shaman
 
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RE: 30-06 close range

Postby shaman » Fri Dec 25, 2009 12:53 am

ORIGINAL: danesdad

I'd bet at close ranges, all three will most often pass right through.


In 28 seasons, I've never recovered a 30-06, 308 WIN or 30-30 bullet.   I've recovered shotgun slugs and ML bullets, but never anything from the  Thutties. The entrance holes are .3" and the exit holes range from .75" up to 4" depending on what gets hit and how close.  I'd say the average is about 1.25"

I did have one goofy shot that ricocheted of the inside of the opposing shoulder and got lost -- never found an exit hole and never found the bullet.  The chest cavity looked like it had been in a Cuisinart.
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Everyday Hunter
 
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RE: 30-06 close range

Postby Everyday Hunter » Fri Dec 25, 2009 7:48 am

ORIGINAL: shaman

In 28 seasons, I've never recovered a 30-06, 308 WIN or 30-30 bullet.

I've shot many deer with the .30-06, and don't remember ever recovering a bullet. I've never shot one with the .308. And I had never shot a deer with a .30-30 until last year. I hit the deer at a forward angle just behind the shoulder at about 75 yards. The bullet was a 170-grain Federal Fusion. It hit a rib on entry and angled slightly, traveling back through the chest cavity, abdomen, and the far hip joint, shattering the ball and socket. It lodged just under the skin covering the hind quarter. I cleaned it up and weighed it, and it was still over 160 grains after hitting three bones (rib, ball and socket) and traversing through more than two feet of deer.

I think that's pretty impressive performance.

Steve
When the Everyday Hunter isn't hunting, he's thinking about hunting, talking about hunting, dreaming about hunting, writing about hunting, or wishing he were hunting.
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